Random Charge length...

[nidsandwolves]

Anyone else frustrated with random charge length? Specifically with termagaunts. Played a game yesterday vs. orks where 3 out of 5 charges failed - all with distances of 5 or less. The biggest issue was a turn 3 charge when I attempted to assault a boyz and warlord (big mek/kff) squad with two squads of gaunts. A squad of 9 made it (2 inches away). A second squad of 15 failed a 4" charge... This allowed the ork warboss and boyz to kill the 9 gaunts (3 of which died to overwatch on the way in...another fun add on) and retreat from the tarpit - preventing my army from advancing and backing up the assault. The ork player was able to bounce his warlord around - eventually to the 12 grotz + 3 artillery unit that is T7 and very resilient this edition. I had the game in hand when a single PK nob (from the first squad i failed to get the charge on) ran over and claimed an objective turn 6. No problem - I had a walking tyrant 5" from charging on my turn - what happens? I fail the charge roll....Game ends after that and I lose.

Random assault and overwatch really can lose the game for a termagaunt heavy army. /rant over

[Deleted]

Yeah, it sucks. We all know.

[Illithid]

I don't find it that bad of an issue with re-rolls from fleet. Sure you fail sometimes, but other times get lucky and get a 2nd squad in that was 9-11" away.

[commandersasha]

I think it's a very messy mechanic, and like a lot of the changes in 6th, makes luck more important than strategy.

[lordbob]

You had a bad game, and it is something that has messed up a bit in this edition unfortunately, but make the best of it, instead of trying to always get the safe charge distance and then occasionally going short, aim for the longer shorts aswell. I see it more as a reason for more aggressive charges. Perhaps you can house rule it for your groups if it bothers you that much

[gigasnail]

sure, aim for longer charges, eat more overwatch and stand still more often. sounds legit. come on guys.

[halos]

Assault in 6th really seems to be (in my experience of course, I may be way of base) less of an all-purpose option but has to be used far more carefully. Random charge is a factor here of course, as is overwatch.

You really want to be charging only when necessary or advantageous, and you've got to be canny with it, use those Iron Arm MCs to soak bolter overwatch, or spawn gants into range to soak meltas away from MCs. With the loss of Fearless you can guarantee that any combat will be tied so long as you have more bodies than the foe has attacks, which can give you time to get a larger brood/harder hitter in position for a charge next turn rather than risking a long one now.

I mean sure random charge kinda blows, (and I feel it really should have been a choice between 6" or 2D6" if you want to risk it, but that's irrelevant) but it's not impossible to work around.

[Illithid]

Oct 28, 2012 23:03:29 GMT gigasnail said:

sure, aim for longer charges, eat more overwatch and stand still more often. sounds legit. come on guys.

That was not my advice. I was saying that occasionally you get the 2nd unit in there. You do not eat overwatch with a 2nd unit and neither should you be aiming for it.

What I am finding is eat the Overwatch with your "less than deadly units" and then aim at getting the nasty units in there.

I actually like the mechanic as it works both ways and you need to plan your assaults better.

[N.I.B.]

Yeah, the random charges are a big contributing factor as to why we leave even more chunks of the Tyranid codex on the shelves, more specifically expensive cc units like Genestealers. If you want to gamble, you might as well do it with cheap stuff (Termagants). After all, the loss of No Retreat means in 6th ed you only need to contact the enemy unit to be safely tucked into combat with your nids, until a MC can help out and not just keel over from No Retreat wounds.

[gigasnail]

illithid was responding to lordbob, not you.

i agree with your points though; you have to pretty much plan to use two or more units to get into an assault with one of the enemy's units. i'm not a fan of this change; i don't have to plan to shoot with two or three units to damage one of my enemy's.

it's all good though, the edition is what the edition is and we're stuck with it for the next 5ish years. i haven't found the changes to be earth shattering (i've won the few games i've played so far) but mostly just annoying and arbitrary.

[Jabberwocky]

Fantasy has had random charges a while now and is generally heralded as a lot more tactical. Certainly more tactical than 5th ed was.

Personally I haven't had any problem with charges. Even when I have failed, I haven't pinned all my hopes on that 1 unit getting in. I've had a back up plan.

I mostly assault now to wreck vehicles if I'm honest, and to ram the Swarmlord into command units or other dedicated assault units that would otherwise charge him anyway.

[gigasnail]

it certainly changes things. i haven't got enough games under my belt in 6th to be comfortable with it. it's not this one change (random charge lengths), it's the changes to assault in general (furious charge nerf, challenges, etc) and how they effect the three armies i enjoy (chaos, tyranids, blood angels) that i find irritating. like i said, i'm still winning and adapting and building plastic doodsmen so it's not like i'm quitting. just annoyed.

having the game change is good, i just think they could have changed it in ways that didn't seem to favor one kind of army/style of play grossly more than others.

[lordbob]

Oct 28, 2012 23:03:29 GMT gigasnail said:

sure, aim for longer charges, eat more overwatch and stand still more often. sounds legit. come on guys.

Oh ofcourse how silly of me, because you can't possibly fail charges when they're short charge ranges, and don't get overwatch either. I see the light now.

Well sit there for a couple of turns and be afraid not to take those long charges because they won't shoot at you in the meantime while you move closer to the enemy. And ofcourse overwatch will kill everything in your unit if you miss the charge, regardless of whether you were a long way or not, good advice I say.

As I said, random charges are messed, but you know what, they exist now, so either sit around and moan about it like you're currently doing, use a different army or try and take advantage of it

[fleetofclaw]

Random charge length removes a good deal of tactics from assault and reduces it to a game of roulette. It's stupid and doesn't even make sense, but oh well it's what we have.


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[benseek24]

Yeah I hate random charge distance.
On average it should be better, but sometimes the under average rolls can lose the game