Some new 6th rumours, how would they effect us?

[malebranche]

That could be worth considering, rcrih.

They might have taken out the re-rolls for poison, but now it wounds normally if you're creatures stronger anyway. Still a major kick in the teeth for genestealers, but hormies and gargoyles are still just as effective against marines. Its a nerf, but tolerable. I was thinking of switching to AG anyway, by genestealers don't need higher initiative.

I haven't heard the 50% reserves thing anywhere else, so hopefully its not true anyway.

Also, screw you, spell check. "Genestealer" is a perfectly acceptable word, stop telling me otherwise.

[guns]

Jun 28, 2012 0:05:35 GMT N.I.B. said:

The Bonesword rumour is an assumption. We'll know on saturday. Unless it's FAQed to be AP3 it will continue to ignore armour, as it doesn't have the description 'Power Weapon'.

I'm throwing a somewhat juicy bone out there - Regeneration is now a new USR called It will not die;

At the end of each friendly turn, roll a D6 for each model with this special rule that has less than its starting number of Wounds or Hull Points, but has not been removed as a casualty or destroyed. On a roll of 5+, that model regains a Wound or Hull Point.

Reg doubled in effectiveness? I could live with that, only problem is that point costs will start to build up, fast.

I got excited by this too at first, but we're forgetting how Regeneration actually works; you roll a die for each wound lost and can regain multiple wounds.

So if you're only rolling for one wound, then yes, the effectiveness is doubled. If you're rolling for multiples, then I think at some point of wound loss the current version of Regeneration might be superior. I'm terrible at math, though, so I have no idea how to calculate whether or not a 1/3 chance to regain a wound is more reliable than 3 * 1/6 chances.

By the way, the guy on BOLS just addressed his earlier claim (reposted here) that Tyranid players would see a light at the end of the tunnel, and it basically turns out he was talking out of his ass.

He says our MCs get better because of Fear, Smash, etc., etc. (all the rules we already pinned down ourselves) and then guesses that the FAQ will help us. But he never had any solid information to back his claim up, and was just basing that comment on his opinion about 6th edition MCs.

[coredump]

Jun 27, 2012 17:32:25 GMT rcrih said:

Missile launchers have an AA missiles: Str 7 AP 4 and skyfire. Long Fangs just became pretty nasty AA especially against the Harpy.

Please tell me this is wrong... the *last* thing this game needed was another reason for missile spam....

[webebuggin]

I'm with holding all judgment now until faq. There is just to much in the air for nids as is

[pseudonymion]

I asked the question of Reserves to the guy over at BoLS (with the rulebook?) and he responded with this..

RESERVES
ONLY HALF YOUR FORCE ROUNDING UP MAY BE PUT INTO RESERVE (MAXIMUM).

reserves come on just like 5th EXCEPT i cant find were it says they do or dont get to assault the turn they move on, it does say it just move the model onto the board using there movement..
if an immobile unit is in reserve (i would be thinking weapons turrets here) it comes in using the deepstrike special rule. as it has been airdropped orteleported onto the field.


I need a "6th ed." list for Monday night so I guess I'll plan using this guidance. I've built six Mycetic Spores, three Trygons, etc. so... I guess there's always Apoc. Anyway, until rulebook and FAQ is in hand, I'm not getting excited.

[coredump]

Personally, I never really liked the idea of null deployment lists..... just didn't play out how I envisioned a game being. Kinda like a team deciding to skip the first quarter of a game. I realize folks liked those lists.... and I am sorry for them. But I prefer the game to be played starting on turn 1.


BLord Boost: Apparently when there is a character challenge, you *do* move into base contact, so you can use hypnotic gaze. That makes a big difference.
From what I hear, you can turn down a challenge, anyone know what happens then?


Pseudo, I thing Gargs are going to be a great unit in 6E. Great movement, extra hits on the attack, can surround and wreck transports (and passengers) And still pretty cheap.


Also... I *think* any MC with wings is considered a 'flying MC'; but I don't feel certain about that. (It would be cool). There may be a difference between a 'winged MC' and a 'flying MC'.


I don't know how we are supposed to take out a flyer.... I just don't see it. OTOH, with the movement restrictions for flyers (pivot up to 90 degrees, then move 18-36" in a straight line) I am not sure how effective they will be...

[kenji10000]

Jun 28, 2012 2:38:35 GMT coredump said:

Personally, I never really liked the idea of null deployment lists..... just didn't play out how I envisioned a game being. Kinda like a team deciding to skip the first quarter of a game. I realize folks liked those lists.... and I am sorry for them. But I prefer the game to be played starting on turn 1.


BLord Boost: Apparently when there is a character challenge, you *do* move into base contact, so you can use hypnotic gaze. That makes a big difference.
From what I hear, you can turn down a challenge, anyone know what happens then?


Pseudo, I thing Gargs are going to be a great unit in 6E. Great movement, extra hits on the attack, can surround and wreck transports (and passengers) And still pretty cheap.


Also... I *think* any MC with wings is considered a 'flying MC'; but I don't feel certain about that. (It would be cool). There may be a difference between a 'winged MC' and a 'flying MC'.


I don't know how we are supposed to take out a flyer.... I just don't see it. OTOH, with the movement restrictions for flyers (pivot up to 90 degrees, then move 18-36" in a straight line) I am not sure how effective they will be...

I've read somewhere if you decline the challenge the one who declines doesn't get to attack. But that seems like forever ago after reading so many different rumors

[coredump]

Supposedly it is 'just like fantasy', if folks know how that works (I heard the same as you....)

From folks at BoLs, there is apparently some confusion from various sources about poison and the rerolls.... so dont' panic yet.

Also, as I have been saying... people seem to be assuming that reserves come in on a 3+ on turn two. I have yet to find specific confirmation. *Flyers* come in on a 3+, but not sure about everything else. (BoLs guy said reserves came in just like 5th..... )


THere are a couple new rules that depend on Ld (like TMC Fear), so the BLord power may have some actual uses.....


I have read a couple of places that Fleet lets you reroll 1 of the Charge dice. Not sure, but I *think* that is better than rerolling them both... but will have to do the math...


Also getting some funky info about reserves. Like the limit is 50% *after* what has to be put in reserves (flyers, lictors, etc) But some confusion how drop pods count, and how their passengers count.
By one telling, a spore and its passengers *have* to be in reserves... thus not part of the 50%.

IOW, don't panic until we get better info.



YAY!! My hopes have been met. Missile launchers do *not* have a third option with Skyfire. There is apparently a new thing, called a Flak missile, that has skyfire.


ARGH!! The net giveth, and the net taketh away....
Apparently some/many/all/whatever of missile launchers will have the option/ability/potential to upgrade to Flakk missiles. I am starting to really hate missile spam.


MOAR ARGH!! Apparently, Jump Inf can *either*
-use their packs during movement, thus moving 12" instead of 6", or
-use their packs during assault, thus getting the reroll and the extra hits (aHammer of wrath)

Way to nerf the one bright spot I thought I had found. (OTOH, Don't Panic.... rumors are flying fast and furiously..... and not all are accurate.)


BIGGEST ARGH!!! I saw the pic of the page saying that you can not charge on the turn you come in from reserves.....

Now... there may be things we don't know (like all outflanking can charge...) But we keep getting more and more info that is just *killing* assaults.

[coredump]

I decided to start a new post...


From what i can see, it seems like they are moving away from 'units' and more towards 'models'

The most detailed info I have read about wound allocation is you keep rolling on the closest model, until he dies, then roll for the next model. Using individual toughness and saves.


Similarly, when a unit moves, you can have certain models move, and other stationary. So the stationary model can fire its heavy weapon, for example.

[triplare]

50% unit cap in reserves. No assaulting when arriving from reserves. I could 'swallow' all the other changes, but I can't even have my army assault when walking on from my own table edge now? That hurts.

[pseudonymion]

Again Rumorville, so keep an open mind.

Flying MCs are supposed to be able to use the "Vector Strike" against Flyers. D3+1 unmodified strength against side armor. To me, it just doesn't seem very effective (a Flyrant can, at best, glance armor 12 (a Harpy does nothing??) and most flyers have 3 hull points). Glancing away the hull points may be the way to go (or only way to go). Snap fire is also an option (although I currently do not run Heavy Venom Cannon on anything I play regularly -- and it's a Blast weapon anyway). And yes, Flying MCs are supposedly a separate beast and use a different set of rules from "flyers."

Core,
Gargs are going to be great. A flying screen with range that will provide MC's 25% cover, gets extra attacks on assault (at I10) and shooting auto wounds on 6. Oh, AND cheap. Still, not sure how assaulting into cover will work for the extra attack.

I am psyched about Raveners (a personal favorite). 12 inch move, ignores terrain and rending claws to eliminate Terminators.

Rumors about MC's almost seem too good. Surely if the rulebook gives, the FAQ will takes away.

[immortalblue]

Jun 27, 2012 20:27:20 GMT N.I.B. said:

Jun 27, 2012 19:08:43 GMT immortalblue said:

Null deployment also got a nerf; you can only put half your units in reserve.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using ProBoards

Source? Because that just killed a competitive and very fun way of playing Tyranids.

The rule book in my lap. I can add a picture if you like.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using ProBoards

[coredump]

Immortal: Could you check on a few things for me? I saw where it said you can't assault from reserves. Are there any 'bulk' exceptions to that rule? Like.. outflanking allows assaulting. Or that rule is only for those that deepstrike, or something like that??

Could you verify that FLeet gives you the option to reroll one *or* both dice for the assault roll?

Could you clear up how jump infantry work? Do they need to choose between Moving 12" *or* reroll assault and get Hammer of Wrath?


COuld you give some of the details about reserves. Is that 50% of your entire army? Or does that not count things that *have* to be put in reserve? (such as flyers.) How do drop pods and passengers figure into that?


What do standard reserves (not flyers) need to come in on turn 2? 3?

Flying MCs have special rules... does that count any MC with Wings? Or is it a special designation?


And last of all, could you please check on the particulars of how poison works now.


Thanks

[guns]

Just heard that Poison still allows rerolls.

You might as well confirm that for us, Immortal.

[andy089]

Jun 28, 2012 1:39:55 GMT guns said:

Jun 28, 2012 0:05:35 GMT N.I.B. said:

The Bonesword rumour is an assumption. We'll know on saturday. Unless it's FAQed to be AP3 it will continue to ignore armour, as it doesn't have the description 'Power Weapon'.

I'm throwing a somewhat juicy bone out there - Regeneration is now a new USR called It will not die;

At the end of each friendly turn, roll a D6 for each model with this special rule that has less than its starting number of Wounds or Hull Points, but has not been removed as a casualty or destroyed. On a roll of 5+, that model regains a Wound or Hull Point.

Reg doubled in effectiveness? I could live with that, only problem is that point costs will start to build up, fast.

I got excited by this too at first, but we're forgetting how Regeneration actually works; you roll a die for each wound lost and can regain multiple wounds.

So if you're only rolling for one wound, then yes, the effectiveness is doubled. If you're rolling for multiples, then I think at some point of wound loss the current version of Regeneration might be superior. I'm terrible at math, though, so I have no idea how to calculate whether or not a 1/3 chance to regain a wound is more reliable than 3 * 1/6 chances.

By the way, the guy on BOLS just addressed his earlier claim (reposted here) that Tyranid players would see a light at the end of the tunnel, and it basically turns out he was talking out of his ass.

He says our MCs get better because of Fear, Smash, etc., etc. (all the rules we already pinned down ourselves) and then guesses that the FAQ will help us. But he never had any solid information to back his claim up, and was just basing that comment on his opinion about 6th edition MCs.

5+ is better than 6+, no matter how many models you have.
X*2/6 (for 5+) vs. X*1/6 (for 6+) where X is the number of wounds lost.
The only question is: Do you lose (and survive) enough wounds to be able to use it?
And I am asking myself - why would anyone take old one eye?

I am telling you now - those dakkafexes will be pretty neat!
Carnifex + 2x Devourers + Regeneration; Take 2-3; Support by Venomthropes;
Just glance everything to death...

What I am really looking forward to is using Bioplasma (mind you, blast weapons always use full strength) - not going to be great, but I like the fluff