Official Points change for Biovores 65pts/model.

[goodbrood]

Jul 8, 2023 14:52:00 GMT infornography said:

Yeah, blaming the playerbase for poor balance is silly. The blame clearly sits with GW. They are 100% in the driver's seat.
The META informs the balance because that is what we have to work with. You can't think of a better way because there isn't one. And trust me, it is way better than having the balance be entirely uninformed as it seemingly was some editions.
We are still super early in this edition and a lot is going to change very quickly, but it will be at least until the end of the year before anything resembling reasonable balance returns. These indexes are really rough and I fully expect the balance to get worse before it gets better as the first codecies hit and shake things up even more.

My hope doesn't rest with our codex but further down the road as GW finally gets their stride this edition and starts modifying dataslates to rein in the most egregious issues and the points start to level out. What I want out of our codex is army rules that are not frequently entirely inconsequential (Shadow in the Warp) or actively bad for us (Synapse). If our leadership values were in line with other codecies, but Synapse gave us roll 3 keep 2 plus some bonus depending on the synapse source I think it would be way better, but as long as they keep trying to punish us for being out of synapse instead of reward us for being in it, it is more of a detriment than a bonus.

I thought the synapse rule was the test on 3d6, not roll 3 keep 2.  9" standard synapse range would be nice with a bump to 12" for upgraded (Swarmlord and Synaptic Linchpin, if I remember correctly).

[nidsallday]

Jul 8, 2023 15:44:48 GMT goodbrood said:

Jul 8, 2023 14:52:00 GMT infornography said:

Yeah, blaming the playerbase for poor balance is silly. The blame clearly sits with GW. They are 100% in the driver's seat.
The META informs the balance because that is what we have to work with. You can't think of a better way because there isn't one. And trust me, it is way better than having the balance be entirely uninformed as it seemingly was some editions.
We are still super early in this edition and a lot is going to change very quickly, but it will be at least until the end of the year before anything resembling reasonable balance returns. These indexes are really rough and I fully expect the balance to get worse before it gets better as the first codecies hit and shake things up even more.

My hope doesn't rest with our codex but further down the road as GW finally gets their stride this edition and starts modifying dataslates to rein in the most egregious issues and the points start to level out. What I want out of our codex is army rules that are not frequently entirely inconsequential (Shadow in the Warp) or actively bad for us (Synapse). If our leadership values were in line with other codecies, but Synapse gave us roll 3 keep 2 plus some bonus depending on the synapse source I think it would be way better, but as long as they keep trying to punish us for being out of synapse instead of reward us for being in it, it is more of a detriment than a bonus.

I thought the synapse rule was the test on 3d6, not roll 3 keep 2.  9" standard synapse range would be nice with a bump to 12" for upgraded (Swarmlord and Synaptic Linchpin, if I remember correctly).

it is, but info suggested an alternative which doesnt force GW to give us bad leadership so 3d6 isnt 100% guaranteed in synapse. with infos suggetion we wouldnt have such bad leadership outside of synpase but still not 100% guaranteed inside either.
and i fully second the wish for usefull or at least not hurting army rules! sitw is more like shitw, and synapse 3d6 is forcing GW to give us bad ld making us sucky outside of synapse.

[Iryan]

I mean. Look at how synapse used to be prior to 8th edition.

On the one hand, inside it you automatically passed any morale checks and were immune to fear. So that was more powerful than today.

On the other hand, morale on all non-synapse units was still bad, and if you found yourself outside of synapse, every unit had to do a morale check on that bad leadership and upon failure the units would either start running away or eating themselves.

So, we have it a lot nicer in that regard than we used to. I definitely would appreciate a 9'' range though.

Edit: Also, regarding changing synapse to a "3d6 drop lowest" morale check, funnily enough, that is what the WH-Fantasy lizardfolk used to get for their non-skink units as a general rule (not sure how it is in AoS). As in, all Saurus units just rolled morale on 3d6 drop lowest rather than 2d6. Was a nice rule.

[infornography]

yeah, Synapse has always been a boon or bust sort of thing, but before 8th edition we had 12 inch synapse range and unless things were going really badly or you screwed up, generally it just meant you were permanently fearless.

There was one time that we actually WANTED our monsters out of synapse because it would grant them melee bonuses. I think it was early 6th edition...

At any rate. I'm tired of it. Almost no other faction still has a faction ability that actively hurts them anymore. I'd take a slightly less good morale resistance when within synapse to be rid of the substantial downside outside of it. I'd rather synapse mostly be for other benefits granted by the synapse source. I want Synapse to make us better when we are within it, not just remove something that makes us worse without it.