T-cyte & RI

[dkng]

Can we use Rapid Ingress on a T-cyte?
The opponent moves, T-cyte lands, units disembark, hopefully survive shooting and charge phases and then on our turn can act normally. Sounds like an awesome thing but there can be something I’m missing in the rules…

[miithos]

Don’t see why not. The restriction is it cannot arrive on a turn it would not be able to normally.

[No One]

It's a tad naff because of the out of phase rules:

OUT-OF-PHASE RULES
Some rules allow a model or unit to move, shoot, charge or fight
outside of the normal turn sequence. For example, the Fire
Overwatch Stratagem enables a unit to shoot in the opponent’s turn
as if it were your Shooting phase. When using out-of-phase rules to
perform an action as if it were one of your phases, you cannot use
any other rules that are normally triggered in that phase.

But DS also has a 'your turn' part, so in order for that to work DS (and thus t-cyte deployment) can't be a movement phase triggered rule for the purposes of out of phase.

Honestly doesn't seem great: doesn't seem we've got anything game-winning good that could go in there, t-cyte isn't exactly cheap and it's also a big footprint to try and fit somewhere to hide. Alternatively, just trygon or ravs T2.

[dkng]

What you’re saying is that the automatic disemarkation will not trigger as the tcyte is deployed out-of-sequence? Sorry english is not my first

[No One]

That...wasn't actually what I was getting at. *Checks* No, that bit's absolutely fine:

Any units embarked within this model must immediately
disembark after it has been set up on the battlefield, and they
must be set up more than 9" away from all enemy models.

Doesn't care what, how or when the t-cyte's being set up, just when it does the occupants get out. Was actually referring to:

Aerial Seeding: This model must start the battle in Reserves,
but neither it nor any units embarked within it are counted
towards any limits placed on the maximum number of
Reserves units you can start the battle with. This model can
be set up in the Reinforcements step of your first, second
or third Movement phase, regardless of any mission rules.

But deep strike has essentially the same sort of wording, so it should be fine (there's some stuff about what it means to "trigger" and thus when the rule actually triggers, but I'm not entirely happy with that myself let alone trying to explain, so I'll leave at 'it works for DS thus should work for similar wording').

[dkng]

Alrighty then so it should work the way I thought.
Two big advantages of this kind of manouver are:
- The opponent has already moved so it is possible for you to hide the tcyte-delivered unit from shooting and/or being charged. Yes I know that „a smart opponent will screen and deny” but it is not always possible and even if - it forces them to stretch and not use units for anything besides area denial.
- The disembarked unit can move before charging. 9” has a 28% chance to succeed so it is highly unreliable to put it mildly. Imagine 20 Horms reaching the soft belly of the opponent (lone operatives, support characters, long range shooters).
I think this is worth a try. Very competitve and super-optimal? Probably not. Fun and surprising? Hell yeah

[No One]

dkng said:

- The opponent has already moved so it is possible for you to hide the tcyte-delivered unit from shooting and/or being charged. Yes I know that „a smart opponent will screen and deny” but it is not always possible and even if - it forces them to stretch and not use units for anything besides area denial.
- The disembarked unit can move before charging. 9” has a 28% chance to succeed so it is highly unreliable to put it mildly. Imagine 20 Horms reaching the soft belly of the opponent (lone operatives, support characters, long range shooters).

Oh, I know, I think rapid ingress is a very powerful strat: does the t-cyte add much over just waiting a turn and getting e.g. a trygon 3" DS with more combat oomph?

[dkng]

Jun 18, 2023 13:57:53 GMT No One said:

dkng said:

- The opponent has already moved so it is possible for you to hide the tcyte-delivered unit from shooting and/or being charged. Yes I know that „a smart opponent will screen and deny” but it is not always possible and even if - it forces them to stretch and not use units for anything besides area denial.
- The disembarked unit can move before charging. 9” has a 28% chance to succeed so it is highly unreliable to put it mildly. Imagine 20 Horms reaching the soft belly of the opponent (lone operatives, support characters, long range shooters).

Oh, I know, I think rapid ingress is a very powerful strat: does the t-cyte add much over just waiting a turn and getting e.g. a trygon 3" DS with more combat oomph?

Time will tell T-cyte and units inside do not count towards SR limit and they can start the pressure T1.

[No One]

SR limit is different from reserves limit, and having >1k pts in reserves is unlikely to be a recipe for success. So it's only the T1, which is impactful, but also pricey.

[gauntlet]

Is the advantage of the Tyrannocyte turn 1, that when your opponent commits to their movement so he can shoot or charge their preferred target, (maybe the scouting genestealers), then you can say, here's a spanner in your plan. I am Deep Striking with Rapid Ingress my superior Melee unit in Tyrannocyte nearby, hopefully on an objective. You could change your plan to sub-optimally shoot my Deep Strike unit, that is not the target of Oath of Moment, but you are likely going to get at least one of my Melee units and the Monstrous Tyrannocyte, in your face my turn. Possibly even sooner if I can use Heroic Intervention or Carnifex Blistering Assault. You have a difficult decision to make!

Even better if you know in advance what I want to do, because your plans are compromised by hedging every turn against the potential of my worrisome tactic.

Ha ha! You made ineffective moves by acting cautiously but I'm not using my Tyrannocyte turn 1, but compounding the complexity going into turn 2. So then you will have to worry about the Tyrannocyte and Melee unit, Trygon within 3" and 2 units of Raveners. And turn 2 I'm expecting my hormaguants to have moved up 27", ready to charge. You really should have been more bold and moved to get an angle to shoot the genestealers.

Can you feel the oppression of Shadow in the Warp and Deathleaper stalking you?

[hymenopteran]

Being able to drop a unit on an objective that your opponent thought they could move onto turn one could be useful.

Either something shooty with torrent to take advantage of Overwatch, or genestealers with their re-rolls for being close to make melee hurt a bit more. Depending on the situation you could even possibly charge screen the objective holder with the T-Cyte. It may not have legs as a strategy once folks start looking out for it, but I believe it's worth trying as a war trick.