Post by brianb9999 on May 26, 2021 13:20:21 GMT
No sure how many people on here have knowledge of Blood Angels, but I’ve recently built up a 2000 pt force and got a few practice games in. I wanted to give them a spin in a casual, yet competitive RTT over the past weekend, but I got rolled, going 0-3 and finding myself questioning the validity of the faction in the current meta. List is as follows:
Patrol detachment
Relics of chapter x2
Chapter Master on Bike: Thunder hammer, inferno pistol, warlord, gift of foresight, angel artifice, angel exemplar (artisan of war: adamantine mantle)
Primaris Chaplain on Bike: Master of Sanctity, mantra of strength, recitation of focus, benediction of fury, hero of the chapter: wise orator
5 Infiltrators
5 Vanguard Veterams: 5x lightning claw, storm shields, jump packs
Land Speeder: Multi-melta
Land Speeder: Multi-melta
Patrol detachment
Librarian Dreadnought: Meltagun, Wings of Sanguinius, Quickening
Sanguinary Priest: Jump Pack, Chief Apothecary, Icon of the Angel, Hero of the Chapter: Selfless Healer
5 Infiltrators
7 Death Company Marines: 7x Jump Pack, 4x Thunder Hammer, 3x Pistol/sword
7 Sanguiary Guard: 2x inferno pistol, 5x sword, 5x axe
5 Inceptors: 5x Plasma exterminator
3 Eradicators: 2x Heavy melta rifle, 1x Multi-melta
The idea is to deploy in a blob outside LOS, with the SG, inceptors, eradicators, and characters all surrounding the Sanguinary Priest to get the 6+++. On my first turn, if all goes according to plan, I can give CM rerolls to the eradicators, recitation of focus to the inceptors, and play Wisdom of the Ancients on the Libby Dread to reroll wound rolls of 1. On paper, this should give me a solid first round of shooting to down transports or other fast threats while staying in relatively good position to counterrattack anything that comes close with the SG.
I wanted to have attack bikes in place of the speeders, but my second one has not arrived from GW. Other than that, I felt pretty good about the list going in.
A short summary of the games: First matchup was against Drukhari in Scorched Earth. He had 5 Raiders full of characters and other fun, plus 2 Voidraven Bombers. He went first, moved his Raiders up, and ran his bombers off the table, wounding some of my units in the blob. I mostly survived and moved into position to fire and hopefully charge some of the contents as they came out. After firing the Eradicators, both Speeders, the melta on the dreadnought, and the inferno pistols on the SG (all litanies suceeded, and I did reroll 1’s to wound with Dread) I managed…4 damage to 1 Raider. To say I was disappointed was an understatement (bunch of 5++ made and 2’s rolled to wound). So I finally killed one with Plasma and charged another with the DC who had moved into midfield. Charging the Wyches/Succubus that popped out ended up being a losing plan anyway as they got to go first and delete the Sanguinary Guard. The next few turns saw him wipe most of the rest of my army as I accomplished very little and ended up losing 79-26.
Round 2: I got to face a buddy’s triple Barbed Heirodule list. I had beaten his Kraken Genestealer list in my first game as BA, but this list was a completely different threat entirely, with the 3 big boys plus 6 Hive Guard, Swarmlord, and some GSC bits for scoring/blip shenanigans. We did Sweep and Clear, with me once again losing the rolloff to go first. I had tried to deploy outside LOS of the Heirodules, but couldn’t quite stay completely out of the Hive Guard range without really being in the back corner, so I figured I’d just have to take them to the face for a turn and hope for the best. Turns out he was able to get 2 of the Heirodules into LOS of my blob, so I started my turn down the entire DC and a few other infantry. Again I was forced to commit to accomplish anything and at least took out a heirodule with shooting and SG and charging another. There was a scrum in the middle of the board for a while involving my HQ’s and his hierodule and eventually Swarmlord. I had a turn where I realized at the end that I forgot to fire my Warlord’s inferno pistol and after just rolling it out, I would have done 8 damage to it (7 wounds left) which would have completely changed the outcome of the turn and likely the game. I said it was too late so we just played on, and my melta continued to fail to kill much, leaving a Patriarch on 1 wound and never being able to kill the second Heirodule. I ended up losing 79-62 in a much more competitive yet equally as frustrating game.
Round 3: Another matchup versus Tyranids, this time against the double Dimachaeron list with Swarmlord and a Kronos contingent with 9 Hive Guard and an Exocrine. I love Hive Guard when they are on my side, but wow are they annoying when I’m against them with no way to mitigate their output early. Mission was Overrun, I tried to avoid his Hive Guard with some back line units, but they just have so much board coverage in Dawn of War. So I blobbed up on one side outside LOS so at least the Exocrine couldn’t shoot much first turn. He won the roll to go first, blew up a Speeder and the DC, which died for a second game in a row on turn 1. I moved what I could on my turn but wasn’t going to be able to avoid the shooting with the Exocrine now able to fire. This game consisted of me killing his gaunts, while picking up most of my models and my melta fire either unavailable or failing to cause any damage until the very end when I actually killed a charging Dima in overwatch with my Eradicators. I did prevent him from completing Deploy Scramblers, but that was about all I managed as his army was mostly still intact while I was nearly tabled. We called it 57-37 in his favor.
So I was obviously pretty disappointed in the outcome, but not sure what I learned. It’s obviously not a good idea to put DC in range of being killed on turn 1, but I’m not sure what to do…go back to a 5-man unit and either deep strike or backline them? I’ve gotten Forlorn Fury off once, and it was…ok. But I feel like they at least need to be in assault doctrine, ideally with litany of hate going off for rerolls to max their output. I usually reserve the VanVets and try to get them in for engage points and charging backfield units, but not sure what else to do to mitigate first-turn damage while still being in range to threaten return damage or score objectives. I’m usually taking Engage, Scramblers/Banners, and one based on my opponent’s army (usually Assassinate, but depends) because most events aren’t allowing faction-specific secondaries. Perhaps I should focus on line breaker (or Relentless assault/Oaths of moment if I can use them) so I don’t feel the pressure to spread out and over commit turn 1? Going second every game didn’t help, but I have to have a better plan for going second both in terms of surviving and being able to keep up in the scoring department. I also feel like my melta can’t be as bad as it was in all these games…it was just bad luck.
In terms of the list itself, I’ve been going back and forth between balancing pure killiness (this list for example) and swapping out for some utility pieces (librarian with null zone/veil, whirlwind, etc). I really like the 4 HQ’s currently in the list and I’m not sure what I would cut to change that around. I just got some Bladeguard vets that I could fit in by dropping 2 DC and changing the speeders to attack bikes and infiltrators to incursors, but other than that not sure what else to try. I’m open to any tips/suggestions inside or outside the box (drop pods??)
I left thinking that I'd have a better chance in all of those matchups with my Tyranids or even a Guard/Custodes list I've been toying around with, but I'm going to try to get more practice in the next few months.
Patrol detachment
Relics of chapter x2
Chapter Master on Bike: Thunder hammer, inferno pistol, warlord, gift of foresight, angel artifice, angel exemplar (artisan of war: adamantine mantle)
Primaris Chaplain on Bike: Master of Sanctity, mantra of strength, recitation of focus, benediction of fury, hero of the chapter: wise orator
5 Infiltrators
5 Vanguard Veterams: 5x lightning claw, storm shields, jump packs
Land Speeder: Multi-melta
Land Speeder: Multi-melta
Patrol detachment
Librarian Dreadnought: Meltagun, Wings of Sanguinius, Quickening
Sanguinary Priest: Jump Pack, Chief Apothecary, Icon of the Angel, Hero of the Chapter: Selfless Healer
5 Infiltrators
7 Death Company Marines: 7x Jump Pack, 4x Thunder Hammer, 3x Pistol/sword
7 Sanguiary Guard: 2x inferno pistol, 5x sword, 5x axe
5 Inceptors: 5x Plasma exterminator
3 Eradicators: 2x Heavy melta rifle, 1x Multi-melta
The idea is to deploy in a blob outside LOS, with the SG, inceptors, eradicators, and characters all surrounding the Sanguinary Priest to get the 6+++. On my first turn, if all goes according to plan, I can give CM rerolls to the eradicators, recitation of focus to the inceptors, and play Wisdom of the Ancients on the Libby Dread to reroll wound rolls of 1. On paper, this should give me a solid first round of shooting to down transports or other fast threats while staying in relatively good position to counterrattack anything that comes close with the SG.
I wanted to have attack bikes in place of the speeders, but my second one has not arrived from GW. Other than that, I felt pretty good about the list going in.
A short summary of the games: First matchup was against Drukhari in Scorched Earth. He had 5 Raiders full of characters and other fun, plus 2 Voidraven Bombers. He went first, moved his Raiders up, and ran his bombers off the table, wounding some of my units in the blob. I mostly survived and moved into position to fire and hopefully charge some of the contents as they came out. After firing the Eradicators, both Speeders, the melta on the dreadnought, and the inferno pistols on the SG (all litanies suceeded, and I did reroll 1’s to wound with Dread) I managed…4 damage to 1 Raider. To say I was disappointed was an understatement (bunch of 5++ made and 2’s rolled to wound). So I finally killed one with Plasma and charged another with the DC who had moved into midfield. Charging the Wyches/Succubus that popped out ended up being a losing plan anyway as they got to go first and delete the Sanguinary Guard. The next few turns saw him wipe most of the rest of my army as I accomplished very little and ended up losing 79-26.
Round 2: I got to face a buddy’s triple Barbed Heirodule list. I had beaten his Kraken Genestealer list in my first game as BA, but this list was a completely different threat entirely, with the 3 big boys plus 6 Hive Guard, Swarmlord, and some GSC bits for scoring/blip shenanigans. We did Sweep and Clear, with me once again losing the rolloff to go first. I had tried to deploy outside LOS of the Heirodules, but couldn’t quite stay completely out of the Hive Guard range without really being in the back corner, so I figured I’d just have to take them to the face for a turn and hope for the best. Turns out he was able to get 2 of the Heirodules into LOS of my blob, so I started my turn down the entire DC and a few other infantry. Again I was forced to commit to accomplish anything and at least took out a heirodule with shooting and SG and charging another. There was a scrum in the middle of the board for a while involving my HQ’s and his hierodule and eventually Swarmlord. I had a turn where I realized at the end that I forgot to fire my Warlord’s inferno pistol and after just rolling it out, I would have done 8 damage to it (7 wounds left) which would have completely changed the outcome of the turn and likely the game. I said it was too late so we just played on, and my melta continued to fail to kill much, leaving a Patriarch on 1 wound and never being able to kill the second Heirodule. I ended up losing 79-62 in a much more competitive yet equally as frustrating game.
Round 3: Another matchup versus Tyranids, this time against the double Dimachaeron list with Swarmlord and a Kronos contingent with 9 Hive Guard and an Exocrine. I love Hive Guard when they are on my side, but wow are they annoying when I’m against them with no way to mitigate their output early. Mission was Overrun, I tried to avoid his Hive Guard with some back line units, but they just have so much board coverage in Dawn of War. So I blobbed up on one side outside LOS so at least the Exocrine couldn’t shoot much first turn. He won the roll to go first, blew up a Speeder and the DC, which died for a second game in a row on turn 1. I moved what I could on my turn but wasn’t going to be able to avoid the shooting with the Exocrine now able to fire. This game consisted of me killing his gaunts, while picking up most of my models and my melta fire either unavailable or failing to cause any damage until the very end when I actually killed a charging Dima in overwatch with my Eradicators. I did prevent him from completing Deploy Scramblers, but that was about all I managed as his army was mostly still intact while I was nearly tabled. We called it 57-37 in his favor.
So I was obviously pretty disappointed in the outcome, but not sure what I learned. It’s obviously not a good idea to put DC in range of being killed on turn 1, but I’m not sure what to do…go back to a 5-man unit and either deep strike or backline them? I’ve gotten Forlorn Fury off once, and it was…ok. But I feel like they at least need to be in assault doctrine, ideally with litany of hate going off for rerolls to max their output. I usually reserve the VanVets and try to get them in for engage points and charging backfield units, but not sure what else to do to mitigate first-turn damage while still being in range to threaten return damage or score objectives. I’m usually taking Engage, Scramblers/Banners, and one based on my opponent’s army (usually Assassinate, but depends) because most events aren’t allowing faction-specific secondaries. Perhaps I should focus on line breaker (or Relentless assault/Oaths of moment if I can use them) so I don’t feel the pressure to spread out and over commit turn 1? Going second every game didn’t help, but I have to have a better plan for going second both in terms of surviving and being able to keep up in the scoring department. I also feel like my melta can’t be as bad as it was in all these games…it was just bad luck.
In terms of the list itself, I’ve been going back and forth between balancing pure killiness (this list for example) and swapping out for some utility pieces (librarian with null zone/veil, whirlwind, etc). I really like the 4 HQ’s currently in the list and I’m not sure what I would cut to change that around. I just got some Bladeguard vets that I could fit in by dropping 2 DC and changing the speeders to attack bikes and infiltrators to incursors, but other than that not sure what else to try. I’m open to any tips/suggestions inside or outside the box (drop pods??)
I left thinking that I'd have a better chance in all of those matchups with my Tyranids or even a Guard/Custodes list I've been toying around with, but I'm going to try to get more practice in the next few months.
