Venom Cannon Spam MSU custom fleet, need feedback

[windwalkerranger]

Hello everyone,

Playing against a necron friend tonight, we usually play non-meta, fun lists with at least mediocre competitiveness. Love testing different ideas against eachother. Came with the below list.

This custom hive fleet has 2 battallions of "synaptic augmentation" to get one reroll to hit in shooting and melee, and "metamorphic regrowth" to increase effective wound count (every single model in the below list has more than one wound, spread around multiple smal units).

The idea is to take numerous 3-man venom cannon warrior squads (9 in this case) and heavy venom cannon monsters (1 tyrant and 3 fexes in this case), and anything else that can potentially make use of the reroll to hit and wound (2 biovores, for instance, or a melee tyrant).

There are also two lictors and two ripper swarms to try to get sweet secondary points.




++ Battalion Detachment -3CP (Tyranids) [38 PL, 5CP, 634pts] ++



+ Configuration +



Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)



Detachment Command Cost [-3CP]



Hive Fleet

. Other: Metamorphic Regrowth, Synaptic Augmentation



+ Stratagems +



Bounty of the Hive Fleet [-3CP]: 2 Extra Bio-artefacts



Progeny of the Hive [-1CP]



+ HQ +



Neurothrope [5 PL, 95pts]: Power: Psychic Scream, Power: Smite



Tyranid Prime [5 PL, 80pts]: 2x Scything Talons, Toxin Sacs, Xenogenic Acid



+ Troops +



Ripper Swarms [2 PL, 36pts]

. 3x Ripper Swarm: 3x Claws and Teeth



Ripper Swarms [2 PL, 36pts]

. 3x Ripper Swarm: 3x Claws and Teeth



Tyranid Warriors [12 PL, 189pts]: Adrenal Glands

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: Boneswords, Scything Talons



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Tyranids) [70 PL, 1,365pts] ++



+ Configuration +



Detachment Command Cost



Hive Fleet

. Other: Metamorphic Regrowth, Synaptic Augmentation



+ HQ +



Hive Tyrant [9 PL, 195pts]: Heavy Venom Cannon, Pathogenesis, Power: Catalyst, Power: Paroxysm, Power: Smite, Two Deathspitters with Slimer Maggots, Warlord



Hive Tyrant [11 PL, 210pts]: 2x Monstrous Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands, Power: Catalyst, Power: Smite, Power: The Horror, Resonance Barb, Wings

. Adaptive Physiology: Murderous Size



+ Troops +



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



Tyranid Warriors [4 PL, 66pts]

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior: 2x Scything Talons

. Tyranid Warrior (Bio-cannon): Scything Talons, Venom Cannon



+ Elites +



Lictor [2 PL, 37pts]



Lictor [2 PL, 37pts]



+ Heavy Support +



Biovores [2 PL, 50pts]: Biovore



Biovores [2 PL, 50pts]: Biovore



Carnifexes [18 PL, 390pts]

. Carnifex: Enhanced Senses, Heavy Venom Cannon, Monstrous Scything Talons, Spore Cysts

. Carnifex: Enhanced Senses, Heavy Venom Cannon, Monstrous Scything Talons, Spore Cysts

. Carnifex: Enhanced Senses, Heavy Venom Cannon, Monstrous Scything Talons, Spore Cysts



++ Total: [108 PL, 5CP, 1,999pts] ++



Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

I have 13 units shooting with vc's or hvc's, and 2 biovores. 9 warriors in theory average 18 attacks per round, and with the reroll 13.5 of them should hit, with ap-2 and damage d3 it should mean something, doesnt it? Add the 4 HVC's for 8 attacks, 7 wounds (monsters have better aim then warriors), with ap-2 and 3 damage. But realistically I will have to spread them somewhat on my side to prevent deepstrikes/shadow orb teleport shennanigans, so perhaps the volume will be much lower.

At least the carnifexes will be slightly better in melee with the reroll.

I also wanted to have at least some potential in melee and some disruptive potential, so I will launch a 9-warrior squad towards the enemy led by the prime. The prime I'm testing with xenogenic and 2 scythes, 5 attacks hittin on 2+ and rerolling 1's, and every 5+ is a mortal, should yield at least a mortal every round in melee. Combined with the neurothroph's potential 2d3 mortal wounds it could have an impact perhaps?

The tyrant with HVC, pathogenesis and the synaptic augmentation should reliably score 2 hits with HVC every round.

I also have a melee flyrant who will risk deepstrike + charge (hence the adranals).

QUESTIONS:
Should I keep the murderous size on winged melee tyrant?
Should I keep the twin big deathspitters on the ranged tyrant or should I replace them with a melee option just in case?
You believe this distribution of physiologies and relics are acceptable?

Thanks in advance!

[kazetanade]

Xenogenic is commonly considered bad i think, since at best case you generate maybe 3 MWs on it and burn a relic slot for it. Its a fun piece of tech but not particularly effective. I'd bring Adrenal Gland relic for the drop n charge - 8" reroll is barely 50% now, you at least get 60% with a 9" roll 3 drop lowest. If you can get +1D more, it gets to a really respectable 70%.

The list concept itself is pretty ok. Necrons lack good options for 3D, so you're relatively safe. Gauss Reapers are going to give you a real headache though.

[windwalkerranger]

Thanks kaze!

I will implement your idea for the charge relic I think. While it only affects something that will happen only once, the impact of success or fail in that particular charge might be too important to pass up. I was thinking of rerolling that charge roll in case of failure, but even then it would have been 75% ish.

[tomcaet]

This is my favourite custom fleet combination. Taken primarily for a Synaptic Augmentation re-roll on a Swarmlord (a fitting low volume of strong attacks), with Regrowth as a bonus. I also do take only mutltiwound units, even if on the chaff it doesn't do much, it still hurts the opponent a bit extra when they underestimate the required firepower.
Hive Guard really work for me in that setup too, shouldn't be as good as Kronos re-roll, maybe with Symbiostorm, but they do get this re-roll twice on SMA. Still need to keep a Synapse babysitter, now at 6", but with minimum Warriors should be manageable. Same goes for your Carnifexes and having Synapse within 6".

My theorizing really favours multipurpose Tyrants, with both shooting and melee, but I didn't really try specialized ones to advise for or against. When Adapting Tyrants I really like the look of Voracious Ammunition - I'd probably go for it on a shooty Tyrant, you can still get the 1CP one, don't you?

[windwalkerranger]

Here to tell how the list performed.

Well, the list itself started the game very, very nicely. Necrons came with the dynasty that has agressively territorial thingie, so they are all obsecs, and with 2x20 warriors, 7 lychgards, many characters (chronomancers, technomancers, lord etc.) and the stars of his show, a ctan with meteor and gaze, and 3 giant thingies with doom-thingie weapons (the ones that shoot 48" d6 attacks with str10 and ap-5 when they are stationary).

Other than these three dudes, his long-range shooting is nonexistent (warriors with gauss reapers). In deployment my MSU presence gives me the edge and he has to deploy all towards his long edge, equally distributing the dooms, and places his ctan to the left of the board (from my perspective). I then deploy all my carnifexes and the tyrant and remaining warrior units to my right flank, so that the I can only receive the attention of 2 dooms, and that I'm as far away from the ctan as possible.

He gets the first turn, and his shooting doesn't go very well, despite high number of attacks and getting +1 to hit from the technomancers, the dooms fail to kill 3 man warrior units, instead kill a total of 4 or 5 warriors. I can't remember very well, but I think it was 5 (2 warrior squads down to 1 vc guy, and one has 2). He then advances with everything else towars the middle of the board, with only his lychguard coming to face my right flank carnifex, tyrant, and 4 x 3 warriors.

In my turn, the dice gods decide to punish me for some reason, and at the same time, to reward my necron friend.
I shoot with almost everything onto the 20 warriors coming to the middle objective, In a grand display of total failure, 8 venom cannons (24 attacks) with rerolls and 2 heavy venom cannons (6 hits) later (1 warrior and 2 carnifexes couldn't see them), I down only 9. while the to hit parts are acceptable, I roll so many 1's when trying to wound (and I wound on 2+), and my opponent rolls so many of his 6+ saves that its absurd, and funny. Then some of them reanimate, and I kill a respectable total of 5 warriors. Later, my bonesword warriors charge in and down a whopping 9 more (with 28 attacks s4 ap-2, mind you), of which 5 reanimate. In morale phase he only gets to not break with 1, and he rolls a 1.

This round I use metabolic overdrive to get an objective.

While this rounds shooting was very bad, and my opponent was godly in his armor saves and reanimations, at this stage it still was not very bad. But then, a full week of fatigue starts to wear on me (we started very late and it was 03:00 in the night at this point), and the dice gods start this was fun so they turn the dial up to 11.

In his shooting, the combined might of the doom thingies kill a carnifex, but only because I forgot that the carni had -1 to hit upgrade on him. Had I remembered it, it could have been alive. Nonetheless, on his turn he does some special thing which allows his warriors to fall back and shoot and charge, and 2 warrior groups open up entirely on my bonesword warriors and eradicate them. Still, the damage I was acceptable, despite losing middle of the board.

Now on my side of the story, my tyrant comes in, neurothroph moves nicely into ctan, the lictor comes in to assault one of the doom thingies, and the list is performing really really nicely in terms of tactics and strategies. I deal 3 damage to ctan in psychic (smite and scream), 3 in shooting (1 with a mine from biovore and 2 from a venom cannon shot, for which 5 warrior groups had to shoot, rolled many 1 attacks, and many 1's and 2's to wound).

Now all the tyrant has to do is to deal 3 damage. Considering each hit deals 4 and he makes 5 attacks, hitting on 2's, rerolling 1's, this should be a walk in the park. And if I can kill the ctan, his right flank is completely open, and all his warriors will be surrounded by my army. I intend to pick apart the dooms, and to win afterwards. But with the 5 attacks of the tyrand I roll.... FOUR 1's! Then I reroll them all for scything talons, and roll TWO MORE 1's! With a total of 3 to wound rolls, I also forget to use the voracious apetite, and make a grand total of one 4+ to wound roll (I have murderous size), for which he saves. Then the ctan attacks back and kills the tyrant dealing 18 damage, for which I can't use invul saves or feel no pain.

At this point it's 4 in the morning and I'm sleepy and my morale is gone, so I surrender. The ctan was going to chew my right flank, and the lych were going to hold my right, and I was going to lose the points game.

I am happy how the list performed and want to try it again.

[piersonsmuppet]

What are your thoughts on including a Rupturefex? Would depend on if it can re-roll each time it shoots with weapon beast & synaptic augmentation, but I’m pretty sure it works like that. If so, it has similar firepower to 2x VC Carnifex for less pts. Performs worse against units w/ 6+ models or a ++, but gives you a different profile for other targets. MSU’s would let you easily place it after the opponent has 100% deployed. Dermic would probably be needed as well, so would also depend on your attachment to the Sized Tyrant

[hivefleetkerrigan]

If you can, getting ignore AP-1/-2 on the big blob of warriors would really help their survivability. I can go either way on the rupturefex to be honest. I think for this list, the.tow carnifex are better.

[windwalkerranger]

If rupturefex can make use of the reroll in both parts of his shooting, then it may become viable. However, I have a growing feeling for twin-hvc harpies at the moment. Not only it can give me two HVC's in one body comparable to a fex in both durability and price, but it can also give me the ability to charge in and stop one very annoying shooter, or introduce a much needed ability in terms of mobility. Lately I have been weighing mawlocs and harpies and even crones in my mind, and the latter two are starting to grow on me. Sure, a mawloc can do some damage as well as denying the opponent some primary cp's, but the harpy can do it almost equally as good as well. Surely I would be trading some range (mawloc can come in anywhere, whereas the 30" movement on the harpy is large but not as boundless) for some firepower (mawloc is practically useless once it does its trick, other than maybe closing a movement lane for the opponent, which the harpy can do as well). Not only that, the crone version of this line of thinking can also make use of the reroll nicely with its one big melee attack when needed.

So maybe I can trade some carnifexes with two harpies in this list, or I can use some crones as turn 1 annoyance. Also, these would grant me presence of three or four table quarters starting from the first turn for secondary cp's.

Regarding the tyrannofex, I think its worth if it can use the rerolls twice. 48 inch really matters, some lists really can make great use of one or two very long range weapon platforms as definitive threats. I'm thinking of a shooty core with malanthrophe, maleceptor and maybe two rupture tyrannofexes here, standing in the middle of our own deployment area. Must still cook the rest of the army, though. My love for MSU squads are increasing.