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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 15, 2021 13:24:24 GMT
So my club is putting together a 3 game "RTT" that will be played over 6 weeks in peoples homes and socially distanced since covid-19 still is bad around here but we miss the game so much. It will be 2000p and the meta will see all the good armies and lists, some very good players a friendly but competitive athmospeher but also a few more casual lists, i guess. There will be DG, Dark Angels, Necrons, Drukhari, Chaos, admech and orks as far as I know and probably som marines as well. So all the net lists will be present...
I will play my version of the double-macarone list. I will send the list in next week so It might go through some changes but this is how it looks right now and probably will look like:
Kraken:
Swarmlord (WL)(catalyst, paroxysm)
Dakkarant (resonance barb, onslaught, synaptic lure)
21 homagaunts
30 DevGaunts
10 fleshborergaunts
10 fleshborergaunts
Dimachaeron
Dimachaeron
Kronos:
Neuro (Symbiostorm)
ripper
Lictor
6 Hive Guards (enhanced resistance)
Exocrine (Dermic symbiosis)
I have played versions of it a few times, but like noted in another thread it is hard to play and I have not done too well. But it is what I have (almost) ready and I belive in it.
I will keep you updated on my progress and take your advice on my opponents.
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 22, 2021 9:27:58 GMT
I got a test game in yestarday against Necrons. His list was (in rough terms) Silent King, 40 Warriors, Pretorians, Lychguards, Flayers and scarabs.
We played Overrun which is a hold 2 få 5 p mission.
He got to start but I had hidden things well so He did not hit anything first turn. I hit him quite hard back and focsed on warriors. I had my dev gaunts in reserve so the would´t get shot of the board by his warriors teleporting. That meant I did not quite kill them all and since he could reanimate them to another placethan where they were it was hard to get the dima in there to clear it up. But I Had a good feeling aftar Turn 2 since I then had almost all warrios gone and had not lost so much, but from there on I fell apart. Swarmlord got charged by pretorians and thar was brutal, the dimas took some shooting from the SilentKing and I had to drop my devgaunts defensively to clear out some flayed ones so the thing that happens a lot to me playing this list happened: I ran out of steam Turn 3-4 and he could pick me apart even though he only had a few units left.
The choice of reserving dev gaunts or not is hard. I have regreted my decision almost everytime, both reerving them and starting with them on the table. ;-)
Necorns were tough, but I lost the game, not the list, so I´ll keep trying.
Tournament starts next week, I will try to give more detailed bat.reps of those games.
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 22, 2021 9:29:01 GMT
I moved the lictor to Kraken in order to use him to get dev gaunts in. Really missed that yestarday.
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Post by kazetanade on Apr 22, 2021 12:40:35 GMT
I got a test game in yestarday against Necrons. His list was (in rough terms) Silent King, 40 Warriors, Pretorians, Lychguards, Flayers and scarabs. We played Overrun which is a hold 2 få 5 p mission. He got to start but I had hidden things well so He did not hit anything first turn. I hit him quite hard back and focsed on warriors. I had my dev gaunts in reserve so the would´t get shot of the board by his warriors teleporting. That meant I did not quite kill them all and since he could reanimate them to another placethan where they were it was hard to get the dima in there to clear it up. But I Had a good feeling aftar Turn 2 since I then had almost all warrios gone and had not lost so much, but from there on I fell apart. Swarmlord got charged by pretorians and thar was brutal, the dimas took some shooting from the SilentKing and I had to drop my devgaunts defensively to clear out some flayed ones so the thing that happens a lot to me playing this list happened: I ran out of steam Turn 3-4 and he could pick me apart even though he only had a few units left. The choice of reserving dev gaunts or not is hard. I have regreted my decision almost everytime, both reerving them and starting with them on the table. ;-) Necorns were tough, but I lost the game, not the list, so I´ll keep trying. Tournament starts next week, I will try to give more detailed bat.reps of those games. In this game, your play should have been slow start, push him off your deployment for Deepstrike, Devgants into 1 blof of 20 warriors, and Dima into Silent King; as long as the Prae and Lych aren't in range to intercept. HG into SK to remove his 2 menhirs of death. SK cannot 1 round a Dima to death with only 4A of 3D, 6A of 2D, and 3A of 1D, without rerolls to wound(while a Dima can indeed 1 round the SK without his Menhirs to tank hits, and fight again to kill off something else). Exo would pick up a unit of Prae the moment their head sticks up because can't get an invul from any chronomancer other than Orikan. Lychguard can be bogged down if not Novokh. With only random flayed ones and Lychguard, and an unsupported 20 man Necron Warrior blob, he's not much of a threat. Remember in a Necron army, a 20 man blob of warriors is a tank unit - its meant to absorb hurt, and dish it back later. It only hurts a lot if SK is in the picture. Unsupported, engaged on multiple fronts, tagged in combat without Royal Warden, a full unit of 20 is just an obsec brick that does nothing. |
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Post by zimko on Apr 22, 2021 12:46:40 GMT
I moved the lictor to Kraken in order to use him to get dev gaunts in. Really missed that yestarday. The lictor stratagem doesn't require they be the same hive fleet. A Kronos Lictor can bring in Kraken Devgants. |
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Post by kazetanade on Apr 22, 2021 12:50:47 GMT
As a side- I would move Devilgants into Kronos with that lictor to get Symbiostorm. In the matchups where it matters (like this one), symbiostorm Devilgants achieve much more than symbiostorm anything else, and is worth the 2cp to pick up and drop anywhere you need. Kraken all relies on Opportunistic Advance to get far enough, which is admittedly far, but also locks you out up a Dima that turn unless you're good with max 24" move on the Dima (which honestly speaking in my experience, is about 12" too little for what you want to actually charge, and not just closest target).
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 22, 2021 18:23:35 GMT
Tanks for the inputs on the list. Putting devgaunts in kronos is something I’ve considered. The option to run fast and then shoot is nice, but, like you say, often that strat goes to Dimas.
But Lictor goes back to Kronos then since he does not need to be in the same Hive fleet to use as bring reserves in.
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 25, 2021 13:00:05 GMT
Pairings is up and I’ll face this list: (there might be some faults in the list depending on me typing it to BattleScribe but the basics are true)
Chans deamons battalion
+ HQ +
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage [13 PL, 250pts, -1CP]: Armour of Scorn, Exalted Bloodthirster, Great axe of Khorne
Keeper of Secrets [12 PL, 240pts, -1CP]: Exalted Keeper of Secrets, Pavane of Slaanesh, Shining aegis, Smite, Snapping claws, Symphony of Pain, The Forbidden Gem, Witstealer sword
Lord of Change [14 PL, 275pts]: Baleful sword, Bolt of Change, Gaze of Fate, Infernal Gateway, Smite, Staff of Tzeentch, The Impossible Robe
+ Troops +
Nurglings [6 PL, 88pts]
. 4x Nurgling Swarms: 4x Diseased claws and teeth
Nurglings [6 PL, 88pts]
. 4x Nurgling Swarms: 4x Diseased claws and teeth
Nurglings [6 PL, 88pts]
. 4x Nurgling Swarms: 4x Diseased claws and teeth
++ Supreme Command Detachment +3CP (Chaos - Thousand Sons) [24 PL, 465pts, 3CP] ++
+ Primarch | Daemon Primarch | Supreme Commander +
Magnus the Red [24 PL, 465pts]: Doombolt, Glamour of Tzeentch, Smite, The Blade of Magnus, Warlord, Warptime, Weaver of Fates
++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment -3CP (Chaos - Death Guard) [25 PL, 490pts, -3CP] ++
Plague Company
+ Lord of War +
Mortarion [25 PL, 490pts]: 1. Miasma of Pestilence, 2. Gift of Contagion, Attendant's claws and teeth, Gloaming Bloat, Phosphex bombs, Silence, Smite, The Lantern
So five big deamons and lots of smites, lots of invulsaves and stuff. I’ll read about the spell before the game. Which of the big ones are easiest to kill? I suppuse the Khorne one will be top prioritet?
Feeling good about this matchup. I have enough gaunts to feed his smites for a while and let the Kronos part of my list work while he gets to deal with the Dimas and swarmlord. The player is quite new but has really beutiful army so it’ll be fun.
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Post by No One on Apr 25, 2021 13:37:47 GMT
Which of the big ones are easiest to kill? Depends a bit on what they roll for exalted: the BT or KoS are going to be the easiest most of the time, but they can get good durability traits. Without exalted or WLT, big bird isn't the tank it usually is. Actually, same for Morty: no 5+++ (and doesn't turn off auras, but that's more of a 'nice no Synapse loss' rather than anything super impactful for us). I'd go Magnus if you get first: warptime is the only way the list has great mobility (unless the KoS lucks out on realm racer) and Magnus is also basically the squishiest and the one who gets the most from getting psychic off for weaver and glamour. Otherwise, probably BT ('cause Fly and no advance and charge on the KoS) or KoS depending on exalted, because generally easier to kill. But with no 5+++, smite+shoot Morty and send dimas after the targets they can actually reroll against might work as well. Would depend on what they do if you can just multi-gank something, and what powers go off (esp considering Kronos: probably warptime or miasma I think). Also just murdering the nurglings is an option: think it murders you fast enough that it doesn't matter if you leave it be, but having no scoring's not a good position to be in if it's lost a damage dealer. |
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Post by kazetanade on Apr 27, 2021 7:22:45 GMT
If Morty is the Warlord, go after the big birds/KoS.
If Morty is NOT the Warlord, go after him first.
If you go first, and Magnus doesn't have a 3++ yet, kill Magnus!
That's about the gist of it. The rest you just feed and road bump.
Also not to forget, Devilgants trade pretty good upwards into a KoS or whatever, as long as it has like a 4+ sv. So 4+/4++ is a great profile for Devilgants to burn double shooting into. Just try not to shoot them into Morty and Magnus.
And yea, definitely screw warp time over. Its the most key spell.
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 28, 2021 10:43:18 GMT
So I played my first game against the demons. I have made a battle report in "stormcoil-style". I did however write it in Word and realized that the maps get messed up when i share it so I made a PDF of it and put it on my google drive. Next time i will do it pure Stomcoil style on reddit instead. drive.google.com/file/d/1olQ3160at5MnMBSpnTr73cO5lPhLKfYD/view |
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Post by No One on Apr 28, 2021 11:17:29 GMT
- Don't need to worry about a T1 charge from a stock KoS unless they started on the line or roll up realm racer, it's just 14" M with no Fly
- LoC doesn't have 6+++, not exalted - KoS doesn't fight before chargers - Taking droning instead of gloaming against dimas, yikes Also, Morty WL in sup com (google doc list) does make more sense, but...changed list midway through a tournament or misprint somewhere? |
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Post by wormlord666 on Apr 28, 2021 11:42:59 GMT
- Don't need to worry about a T1 charge from a stock KoS unless they started on the line or roll up realm racer, it's just 14" M with no Fly
- LoC doesn't have 6+++, not exalted - KoS doesn't fight before chargers - Taking droning instead of gloaming against dimas, yikes Also, Morty WL in sup com (google doc list) does make more sense, but...changed list midway through a tournament or misprint somewhere? There might be misprint from my part. There was som discussion among the chaos players in the group with my opponent regarding the list and he changed som things from the version I copied. In the original version Magnus was the warlord but that was illegal, Morty has to be. We talked about it afterwards and I tried to coach him for the next games. I agree that his target priority was not at all right. He should have deployed Morty as close to my shooting as possible and just gone straight at it with him, the BT and the KoS. I must admit that I assumed the KoS had "fly" or some other way to get at me turn 1 and I was surpirsed when I realized during the game that it didn´t, especially since he put behind the ruin. |
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Post by kazetanade on Apr 28, 2021 12:04:00 GMT
Yea, target priority was off. What he could or should have done was send Morty up with Gloam, Warp Time him into range of the right most Dima, charge it, kill it in combat, the conso into the HG to end your game right then and there (there's an assumption he can get within 1" with a 3" conso, ofc). Your entire army strength would be sapped trying to take him off the HG, and with only 1 Exo, 1 Dima, and 1 SL to fight without rerolls... Well, you're basically not getting out of there. Magnus just comes in and eats the Exocrene, and he's down to whittling gaunts away (which is your main strength vs him i think).
Even from his lacklustre starting position, he should have been able to make it a upwards slope for you, so yea.
I'm not familiar with the BT, so my choice would have been Dima into Magnus on top of T1 - as the warp time carrier, he is the guy who makes the list work. At T7, the Dima is suppose to shred him with 6A, reroll everything, and Fight Twice.
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Post by No One on Apr 28, 2021 12:05:20 GMT
In the original version Magnus was the warlord but that was illegal, Morty has to be. Yeah, it's a bit contentious (there was a fairly big tournament a bit ago that ruled otherwise), so just assumed it'd been OK'd. Makes sense. Yeah, they're usually taken in/with a mono-Slaanesh det, which gives advance and charge and you'll generally end up with 1 either given or rolled for realm racer for +4" net /w adv+charge. So they can definitely do T1 charges, even from behind ruins. But not as an add-on to a mixed list.
Edit: Yea, target priority was off. When I read that he warptime'd Morty back to take care of an injured dima, with it still in combat with a full health KoS, and a LoC and Magnus chilling nearby, I was pretty confident how the game was going to go...
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