How will this list Perform? Nidzilla list in a tournament.

[newnid]

I'm new to this forum and am curious how people think my list will perform in a tournament my buddies and I are having.

My opponents are Death Guard, T'au, Space Marines, Drukhari & Harlequins. I designed my list to hopefully intimidate my opponents into staying off the field while I pop up/run around getting objectives. If they decided to move onto the field then I would eat them up for the most part while running around getting objectives. I haven't played a match with this list yet so it should be interesting.

Thoughts?

2000 pts

-1 cp extra relic

-1 cp extra adaptive physiology

10 cp

1 Battalion

Custom Hive fleet:

Prey Sight

Metamorphic regrowth

HQs

Hive Tyrant

Loadout: Wings, 2x Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, Resonance Barb

Powers: The Horrer, Psychic Scream

Swarmlord

Loadout: Warlord

Powers: Catalyst, Onslaught

Neurothrope

Powers: Catalyst

Troops

Tyranid Warriors

Loadout: 3 Models: 2 Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands each

Ripper Swarm

Loadout: 3 Models

Ripper Swarm

Loadout: 3 Models

Ripper Swarm

Loadout: 3 Models

Ripper Swarm

Loadout:  3 Models

Elite

Deathleaper

Lictor

Haruspex

Loadout: Murderous Size

Maleceptor

Loadout: Adrenal Glands

Powers: Paroxysm

Tyrant Guard

Loadout: 3 Models: 2 with Scything Talons, 1 with Lash whip and Bonesword, all with Adrenal Glands

Fast Attack

Raveners

Loadout: 3 Models, Scything Talons & SpineFists

Heavy Support

Toxicrene

Tyrannofex

Loadout: Acid Spray

Trygon Prime

Loadout: Murderous Size, Adrenal Glands, Xenogenic Acid, Biostatic Rattle

[zimko]

If it's against people with casual lists then you might be ok? If the tournament is actually competitive then you'll get trounced. One thing you're missing for sure is decent ranged output (Exocrines and Hive Guard, preferibly as Kronos). Instead, you're running melee monsters. And the monsters you've chosen are horribly overcosted for their damage output (Toxicrene, Haruspex). However, if your opponent's lists are also not optimized, then the Swarmlord and Flyrant might carry you to victory.

[newnid]

Dec 30, 2020 15:50:45 GMT zimko said:

If it's against people with casual lists then you might be ok? If the tournament is actually competitive then you'll get trounced. One thing you're missing for sure is decent ranged output (Exocrines and Hive Guard, preferibly as Kronos). Instead, you're running melee monsters. And the monsters you've chosen are horribly overcosted for their damage output (Toxicrene, Haruspex). However, if your opponent's lists are also not optimized, then the Swarmlord and Flyrant might carry you to victory.

I'd say we're friendly competitive. We are playing to win but I don't think any of us are min-maxing our lists. We're mostly doing it to have some fun and try out new things.

Ya I'm not a huge fan of going ranged with Tyranids. I just can't bring myself to do it. I have to get up in my enemy's face with a swarm or big beasties at some point. I do think having many smites available can work fairly well as a substitute for dedicated ranged units, and against the lists of my opponents I should own the psychic phase in every match up.

How I usually play is to basically use the threat range of my units as a deterrent against my opponent moving forward (while keeping my units mostly out of LoS) and then using my more maneuverable units to turn a flank. I don't know how well this will work in 9th as it's much more about objectives but I do think it should work to a degree to win me some games.

One list (The Space Marine list) is all infantry (2 wounds) which I think the Haruspex with Murderous size should do quite well against. I just don't know if it'll be able to kill them fast enough to keep them off the points/not be killed in a fallback shoot kind of thing. But we'll see.

[helphast]

Space Marines are going to blast most of your monsters off the field by turn 3, Tau are going to screen you out and gun you down by turn 4, you'll never get into melee range against Harlequins until they're ready to kill you, Death Guard are going to laugh off your damage output before shoving multi meltas into your face, possibly worse. Don't know Drukhari well enough to make a call.

Well, I don't know your community as well as you do, but I do know 'Nids, and it looks more like a slapdash collection of your favorite monsters and models more than anything. That's not a bad thing, the best part of the hobby is being able to do what you want, but if there's an actual competition here, don't expect to walk away with more than one win.

If you wanted advice for a more solid or competitive list, there are plenty more folks more qualified for it than I am, but I can safely say six Hive Guard, a brick of nine Enhanced Resistance double scything talon Warriors, and two to three MSU squads of Gaunts or Gants are a solid start. Exocrine is also a tough cookie capable of turning anything short of a T8 tank into melted goo.

As always, remember; winning might be the objective, but the goal is to have fun.

Edit: You might not care for using ranged weapons with Tyranids, but discounting ranged weapons to that extent is a disservice to both yourself and your army. No need to walk into a fight with your dominant hand tied behind your back. Also worth mentioning that Psychic is well and good, until the other player just hides the unit you want to hit behind another unit, and you can't hit it with brain bolts. Makes getting rid of the aforementioned shooty armies' best units impractical at best, impossible at worst.

[newnid]

Dec 31, 2020 11:37:35 GMT helphast said:

Space Marines are going to blast most of your monsters off the field by turn 3, Tau are going to screen you out and gun you down by turn 4, you'll never get into melee range against Harlequins until they're ready to kill you, Death Guard are going to laugh off your damage output before shoving multi meltas into your face, possibly worse. Don't know Drukhari well enough to make a call.

Well, I don't know your community as well as you do, but I do know 'Nids, and it looks more like a slapdash collection of your favorite monsters and models more than anything. That's not a bad thing, the best part of the hobby is being able to do what you want, but if there's an actual competition here, don't expect to walk away with more than one win.

If you wanted advice for a more solid or competitive list, there are plenty more folks more qualified for it than I am, but I can safely say six Hive Guard, a brick of nine Enhanced Resistance double scything talon Warriors, and two to three MSU squads of Gaunts or Gants are a solid start. Exocrine is also a tough cookie capable of turning anything short of a T8 tank into melted goo.

As always, remember; winning might be the objective, but the goal is to have fun.

Edit: You might not care for using ranged weapons with Tyranids, but discounting ranged weapons to that extent is a disservice to both yourself and your army. No need to walk into a fight with your dominant hand tied behind your back. Also worth mentioning that Psychic is well and good, until the other player just hides the unit you want to hit behind another unit, and you can't hit it with brain bolts. Makes getting rid of the aforementioned shooty armies' best units impractical at best, impossible at worst.

Well, I'm determined to prove you wrong helphast. I'm planning to win all the round robbin and bracket matches. I'll let the community know how it goes.

[Freeman]

It’s not optimised but you know that.

The trick is about scoring enough points to win. You need to be confident of getting around 80pts. You’ve got an easy way of getting scramblers and all your rippers should help with engage on all fronts.

Your Neurothrope is probably going to have to become a psychic secondaries piece so i wouldn’t think he’ll cast very often.

If you can 35 ish on secondaries you’ve got a good chance.

[Freeman]

It’s not optimised but you know that.

The trick is about scoring enough points to win. You need to be confident of getting around 80pts. You’ve got an easy way of getting scramblers and all your rippers should help with engage on all fronts.

Your Neurothrope is probably going to have to become a psychic secondaries piece so i wouldn’t think he’ll cast very often.

If you can 35 ish on secondaries you’ve got a good chance.

[No One]

newnid said:

How I usually play is to basically use the threat range of my units as a deterrent against my opponent moving forward (while keeping my units mostly out of LoS) and then using my more maneuverable units to turn a flank. I don't know how well this will work in 9th as it's much more about objectives but I do think it should work to a degree to win me some games.

So, there's a few issues with this idea. It mostly boils down to what others have said about how most of our melee is bad.
They're not survivable, so need to hide. Not manoeuvrable, so have difficulty getting to a good position to hide, and their threat range from that spot is then mediocre. And then the output isn't anything amazing, and often needing strat support to not just be bad.

What you're left with is an inability to effectively contest onto objectives: even if you can position well, you're going to struggle to have the output to shift ob sec, let alone melee bricks like BGV with rites. Your opponent will often be fine just wandering into that threat range if they've built for 9th well, and then...you die, or make charges, don't do enough, and die? There's some potential with just threat overload, but...you're going to really struggle to not just get picked off.

The other issue is scoring in general: you don't have any great secondaries (except engage with all the rippers): deploy is fine with swapping DL to a lictor (just don't take deathleaper, it's just bad). But then you're giving up an easy 15 pts on big game, and the masses of rippers don't really defend objectives well (stuff like rites of war outriders, SMS spam, dark technomancer venoms or just harleys in general could easily knock you off an objective with stuff that isn't needed to deal with your midfield).

Freeman said:

You’ve got an easy way of getting scramblers and all your rippers should help with engage on all fronts.

I don't think he does: with only 3 scrambler-capable units, I'd be concerned about midfield.

[afewveiws]

Afew things that could shore up a couple undibatable issues:

-Deathleaper is nothing more then a more expensive lictor since the +/- to hit penalties are capped at +/-1. Save the points.

-Trygon primes bring so little to talk of in general but for your particular list it offers almost nothing. The taxi part is going to be almost completely wasted due to the only unit being able to go in with him is the 3 man chaff clearing warriors. I see you are planning on useing the strat to maximize your odds of getting the charge off but its even more resources dumped into a roughly 60-70% charge.
More reliable to save the points and cp you used for the prime upgrade and keep it a standard trygon. It will still be just as much of a smash beast if it makes the charge but will cost your army less resourses when/if it fails to.

-the tyrant gaurd with a bone sword and lash whip... why? Its a waste of points, just keep them cheap you intend for them to die and 3 protecting swarmy will only last 1 round of shooting if they get catalyst on them and are out of los but in range to take wounds for swarmy. Best placement for them is next to both swarmy and flyrant so group the tyrants alittle for first turn.

-the raveners are interesting for me. I see them as good for jorm fleets. In your list they seem out of place. Min sized unit would struggle clearing anything except maybe way out of possition ig units of 10 or less moddels.
Your better off with a second unit of warriors honestly.



My last parting words for you is an oppinion, much like the above, but will not be holistically agreed upon by the community here.
I stand by the traditional approach that warriors have always worked on, being good in both shooting and melee, dual boneswords have comparable if not superior output then dual sytals and takes only 1 arms slot. This means you can litterally make them better in melee and give them good guns. The counter arguement is that they would be more points investment soo...

take this as you will and good luck.

[No One]

afewveiws said:

-Deathleaper is nothing more then a more expensive lictor since the +/- to hit penalties are capped at +/-1. Save the points.

Worse than an expensive lictor, since it can't do non-Char actions.

-Trygon primes bring so little to talk of in general but for your particular list it offers almost nothing. The taxi part is going to be almost completely wasted due to the only unit being able to go in with him is the 3 man chaff clearing warriors. I see you are planning on useing the strat to maximize your odds of getting the charge off but its even more resources dumped into a roughly 60-70% charge.
More reliable to save the points and cp you used for the prime upgrade and keep it a standard trygon. It will still be just as much of a smash beast if it makes the charge but will cost your army less resourses when/if it fails to.

Also (especially combined with DL) is quite vulnerable to assassinate.