On averedge, how is the Ork matchup?

[niiai]

How do you find the ork matchup?

I find it very hard. So much of what they have is so though for us. Ork boys with da jump turn one. Very hard to screen for, and you often loose more points fighting them then they invest.

Hidden power fists are hard.

The T8 transport vehickle with the deathroller. The T8 Morkanaught with BS4.


Even Flashgits who usualy are considered bad I suspect torally wrecks me.

Besides crushing claws (who are bad except on old one eye) we have no S8 weapons in melee. Most of our shooting stops at S8. And my opponent usualy targets that as soon as possible, once I run out I can not stop the T8. While accidental, it feels like the numbers just work out better for the ork.

[beetlejuice]

Haven’t played orks much but flyrants with smite and psychic scream should chip a few wounds. Pair with swarmlord with voracious appetite for rerolls to wound does quite reliable dmg with the mortal wounds in addition, fight twice if you can spare the CP. Super flyrant or trygon prime with murderous size and voracious appetite, even better with toxin sacs and behemoth psychic. Double shooting kronos hive guard with symbiostorm. That’s how I deal with my friend who plays TS and T8 chaos knights anyway.

Maybe drop meitotic spores so you can use kronos strat deepest shadow on his psyker, makes da jump impossible to cast on only 1d6 WC7 within 24” of your unit unless he can dish out 6 mortal wounds in psychic phase first.

[iniquity]

Ive been wondering about this,

I’d considered just taking mieotic spores in a Kronos detatchmemt to shut down dajump and then just screen/move block.

[kwisatzhaderach]

Sept 7, 2020 16:25:15 GMT iniquity said:

Ive been wondering about this,

I’d considered just taking mieotic spores in a Kronos detatchmemt to shut down dajump and then just screen/move block.

The only thing is that they still have a 50% chance of casting the power, since it's WC7 and the Weirdboy can get up to +3 to cast. I guess better than nothing. 

Orks seem to "out-horde" us and "out-cc" us, which are generally our two biggest advantages when playing vs anyone else. 

Seems like the best way to deal with the T8 is hope that the Hive Guard with double shooting get there. Exocrines with Pathogenix Slime and Symbiostorm can tear up a lot of those vehicles, too. 

[panzerfront]

So I play Orks as my main army, simply because by far its my largest and I rely upon having a heavy CC Punch with auxiliary shooting if I either can't engage a target in CC or do not want to engage it in CC. As a rule killing the Characters will hurt the Orks but we don't have snipers so we have to kill them in other fashions. Against orks ripping into Boyz with Warriors and Genestealers has served me well, we ignore their saves and in large groups we have enough attacks to wipe the unit or at least cripple it. Against the T8 Vehicles try Heavy Venom Cannons, Shock Guard or a Rupture cannon on a T-Fex, I've had good luck pairing a pair of venom Cannon Fexes and a Rupture Fex for shutting down enemy armor. Engaging their large walkers in melee is a bad idea for anything save a Hive Tyrant/Swarmlord or OOE.

It really depends upon what the Ork player is bringing, if he's spamming buggies, an Exocrine or two will serve you well, as will Hive Guard with Impaler Cannons. Boy heavy list, volume of attacks will do him in, so Warriors, Genestealers and quad Brainleech Devs. Against Battlewagons with Rollas and Bonebreakas, charge them, particularly the Bonebreaka, as it only gets the extra d6 attacks on the charge. Mix shooting and melee on hard targets and killing them shouldn't be an issue. If he spreads out to cover objectives, bite off his forces piecemeal. Shutting down mek Gunz is essential as we get a lot of value from them, most of my opponents will ignore a naut to target that battery and honestly, they're probably right to do so. The concentration of firepower those and buggies represent is impressive and they have similar wound profiles, T5 vs T6 and 5 vs 9 wounds isnt that great a difference so the guns that are effective against one will work on the other.

[niiai]

The last list was rougly:

1 Psyker with grots and 30 boys.
1 shiny bits morkanaught.
1 car with death roller, ork leader with claws relic, pain boy (medic) 10 boys.
2 dakkajets with ekstra guns.
1 truck with 10 flashgitz, captain badruck.

He gets first turn. Dakkajets take out hiveguards. Flashgits attack warriors (does not do much. Ignore Ap2 and they are D1 thanks to stratagem. But he rolls a 6 two times in a row so he shoots 3 times.) Boys charges warriors. (Let me tell you it is very very hard to have enough chaff to deny da jump.)

Anyway, yes. In the rock paper scissor of 40k orks are better in melee the nids in the matchup, and his shooting is very good at taking out the only things that can shoot his T8. Nothing in the nid list besides old one eye should not fight T8 in melle. That includes the swarmlord.

[iniquity]

Sept 7, 2020 17:23:23 GMT kwisatzhaderach said:

Sept 7, 2020 16:25:15 GMT iniquity said:

Ive been wondering about this,

I’d considered just taking mieotic spores in a Kronos detatchmemt to shut down dajump and then just screen/move block.

The only thing is that they still have a 50% chance of casting the power, since it's WC7 and the Weirdboy can get up to +3 to cast. I guess better than nothing. 

Orks seem to "out-horde" us and "out-cc" us, which are generally our two biggest advantages when playing vs anyone else. 

Seems like the best way to deal with the T8 is hope that the Hive Guard with double shooting get there. Exocrines with Pathogenix Slime and Symbiostorm can tear up a lot of those vehicles, too. 

Yeah absolutely, ive been playing a lot of kraken / kronos recently with a lot of gaunts (pretty much playing from the book of "hide in a corner with swarmlord, sling (please do not swear) onto objectives / move block your opponent. 

Trying to play to our strengths, i think tyranids are faster than orcs especially in kraken so i do think screening da jump is possible. The only other thing i can think of personally is running a GSC patrol (which for me would mean starting on 6cp) and putting a sanctus in there but i dont think it solves the problem as the odds of shutting down the weirdboy with the sanctus arent great.   

Personally orcs and white scars are my most feared match ups because they do what we do but better. 

[niiai]

In 8th edition the sanctus for me was very good at killing weardboys. You deployed ekstra blips in strategic places. Either you killed him in their movement phase or in my turn.

But in 9th edition there has so far been far to easy to hide the psyker out of line of sight. (As it should be.) Killing him turn 2 means the damage already had happened.

As for hiding in a corner: Orks are really good at coming at me! They will take a lot of objectives. Also when the orks boys jump they tend to smash your lines good. After they get their value in killing points they can spend a turn tying up your stuff. It puts you really on the back foot. And if you do not kill them all you can bet they will use green tide and charge turn 2 as well.

While da jump + charge is not a garantee, with the right bonuses it is well above 50%. (Psyker get a bonus to cast da jump.)

I also do not want to cater my list to much. It is just a bad matchup imho.

[iniquity]

Sept 7, 2020 22:58:53 GMT niiai said:

In 8th edition the sanctus for me was very good at killing weardboys. You deployed ekstra blips in strategic places. Either you killed him in their movement phase or in my turn.

But in 9th edition there has so far been far to easy to hide the psyker out of line of sight. (As it should be.) Killing him turn 2 means the damage already had happened.

As for hiding in a corner: Orks are really good at coming at me! They will take a lot of objectives. Also when the orks boys jump they tend to smash your lines good. After they get their value in killing points they can spend a turn tying up your stuff. It puts you really on the back foot. And if you do not kill them all you can bet they will use green tide and charge turn 2 as well.

While da jump + charge is not a garantee, with the right bonuses it is well above 50%. (Psyker get a bonus to cast da jump.)

I also do not want to cater my list to much. It is just a bad matchup imho.

Yeah i completely agree, ive been trying to make "a list" that i use and tbh if i was going to a tournament my approach would probably be "hope i dont meet an orc player" rather than specifically putting the resources into my list to deal with them. 

(please do not swear) orks. 

[hymenopteran]

How are they stacking the bonuses to cast? Are there are exceptions to the only +/-1 rule?

[afewveiws]

Sept 8, 2020 19:30:26 GMT hymenopteran said:

How are they stacking the bonuses to cast? Are there are exceptions to the only +/-1 rule?

Not 100% on this, but im pritty sure that only applies to hit rolls.

[purestrain]

Sept 8, 2020 19:42:23 GMT afewveiws said:

Sept 8, 2020 19:30:26 GMT hymenopteran said:

How are they stacking the bonuses to cast? Are there are exceptions to the only +/-1 rule?

Not 100% on this, but im pritty sure that only applies to hit rolls.

The +1/-1 alamgimation only affects hit/wound rolls.

[garg]

Sept 8, 2020 19:42:23 GMT afewveiws said:

Sept 8, 2020 19:30:26 GMT hymenopteran said:

Not 100% on this, but im pritty sure that only applies to hit rolls.

And wound rolls but yea for casting there is no such cap.

[afewveiws]

Cool i was close lol

[kazetanade]

Sept 8, 2020 19:30:26 GMT hymenopteran said:

How are they stacking the bonuses to cast? Are there are exceptions to the only +/-1 rule?

Like others said, that cap only applies to hits and wounds.

Orks get +1 for every 10 ork boyz or something within 6", to a max of +3.