Question about FOTM (flavour of month)

[Hive Bahamut]

Not a serious thread just a curious question. Has every unit of GSC had some time in the sun, and does it shift each model wave release?

For example: On initial release everyone ran Purestrains and Brood Bros. Once they were priced into Oblivion and no creeds then the torch was passed to Aberrants and Bikes. Once they were priced into oblivion the torch has seemingly been passed to Acos and Neophytes.

I know people deny that these are all planned business moves, but it really does just look like that. Ok these models need to sell, make x rules better.

It still really bothers me GSC is forbid from running Genestealers. That is akin to Admech without walkers, Orkz without Waagh and Astartes without OP Primaris. Nevermind if you do decide to run them they are exempt from rules based around them.

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Throw ridge runners in there for the latest FOTM.

I'd say that trucks/rock grinders haven't gotten their time in the sun yet.

[Kitane]

Trucks might see some light in this edition with Bladed Cog Neophytes, even if GW cancels the interaction between Alphus and embarked Neophytes. Or we will use Chimeras with infantry squads for the objectives.

Rockgrinders, maybe. I fear their only saving grace is an explosive suicide into something.

[PumpkinHead]

The new marine ATV's are going to wreck armor. So light vehicles are going to have a rough day. Even heavy tanks will take a beating against 3 ATVs.

[Hive Bahamut]

Those turrets get me more worried than a mobile element. 3x 2Lascannons or a bunch of Autocannons for probably sub 50 points is crazy and BS2 to top it off.

At least the ATV has a decent footprint to attack, but I never even considered them as better Ridgerunners.

Ooph. Astartes just keep pulling everyone's stuff, making it better AND cheaper and then GW wonders why Xenos are so bitter.

[hivemind03]

Genestealers being priced out of the codex was allegedly a design decision to keep the army from being Genestealers + some other stuff.

From a economic standpoint it also makes a lot of sense to disincentivize purestrains as they are one of the most prolific kits in the game. I dont know about you but I've owned enough Genestealers to make a few armies and going into 8th ed, I had a casual 50 or so even though I hadn't put one on the table in 5 or 6 years. There is no money to be made from them anymore.

[Hive Bahamut]

Why bother put them in at all then? They have had ample opportunity to rehash the kit going even back as far as Ymgarls in 5th. The 2 Princelings in the Tooth and Claw? Were totally new sculpts with 32mm. Worried about Genestealers + other stuff is akin to worried that Orkz will not field boyz because they already have them, or Harlequins bailing on troupes because they don't need Obsec.

They shoot themselves in the foot with dumb responses, pump out another 12 Primaris Lts. and wonder why the xenos sales suck. Turns out good rules actually sell models not vise versa. Harlequins for example don't sell well because they have what, 8 kits? Pretty hard to make a sale when you can buy 6 units and call it a day. Primaris now already has over 50 choices. By default you sell better with more available, nevermind the faction in choice.

That being said those are just examples of why this train of logic is dumb. It actually begs to prove the point that balance is avoided intentionally by GW and sales are the sole driver behind rules. Why bad Lictor? No production, no reason to make good. Outriders? OP to sell new kits, as the Aggressor/Cents get reigned in from last push.

I think at the end of the day I just want some more transparency from them. It is BS to hear that the iconic unit of your army is delegated to bench warmer "in case" they ran the show.

[kazetanade]

I dont disagree with it though - Assuming that BC PGS were a thing, that would invalidate everything else in the codex. There is no need to think about running anything else when you can run 3 x 20 PGS squads, one PA in a turn, with S5 100A, hitting on 2+ and rerolling 1s to wound, exploding on 5+ against Imperium. You'd use this unit as the general hammer and maybe 1 squad of Acolytes with saws to beat anything T7/T8 or too hard to chew on.

Throw in our abysmal PA? PGS would skyrocket in value so hard because now they have a 4++, 5+++, incredibly large footprint that is really hard to stop, ignoring enemy OW on the entry and trapping the enemy entire army in one spot, without much counterplay other than Auspex scan it with Aggressors who will end up getting Vect'ed. And you can do it THREE times.

There would literally be no reason to run anything else, because everything else was so incredibly bad and squishy compared to that.

That said, I would have appreciated that PGS were at least the same price as HGS, so that it didnt feel so extremely terribad to run them especially when we could soup.


edit: Locus is still bad, waiting for him to get his day in the sun. So are Rockgrinders (but they might be better now board is smaller, needs testing, and a 30pt discount). Drills and Cutters have never been good, so Cutters might be. The chemist guy is also never played I think, but changes to him can be really slight to be good (fix his familiar to roll 2 and reroll if same result) assuming Abbys see play again. 

That's... every model in our line accounted for? Not including the trash AM things in it for fluff. 

[hivemind03]

I also prefer GsC to be more about the cult than the Genestealers. I think there are better ways to handle balance though. They could've made purestrains more unique. They then could've made a new kit just for them. I'm thinking like a more elite version that is more of a retinue to the Patriarch/Primus. That way you limit the number that are taken in an army, maintaining the flavor.

But don't try to think "why" so much when it comes to GW. Thats a quick path to madness.

[beetlejuice]

Aug 6, 2020 15:16:56 GMT hivemind03 said:

I also prefer GsC to be more about the cult than the Genestealers. I think there are better ways to handle balance though. They could've made purestrains more unique. They then could've made a new kit just for them. I'm thinking like a more elite version that is more of a retinue to the Patriarch/Primus. That way you limit the number that are taken in an army, maintaining the flavor.

But don't try to think "why" so much when it comes to GW. Thats a quick path to madness.

Easy fix, give them primaris treatment with 2W, 5A and maybe a 1D smite or something cool (just not -Ld...) and max 10 models.

[c4790m]

I wish they let you give them some sort of trait to make up for it, it’s crazy that the genestealer in the codex named after them are weaker and more expensive than purestrains.

Give them first curse as an ability and drop them to hive strain costs at least

[Hive Bahamut]

Ah see now we are cooking. Let me take a stab:

Purestrain Genestealers: Can take 1 squad per Warlord (so 1) like Command Squads via Company Commanders.

First Curse is included in the Warlord descript and allows you to pick 1 of X upgrades for "free"

Purestrains, Patriarch gain a new Keyword locking them out of Creeds but gives them a pseudo one. Like +1A on charge or something generic. Same as Brood Bros but not.. More Niddy. (Joking says WS4 3A)

Purestrains lose the +1A for 10+ (replaced by the +1A charge) and unit size is dropped to 10. (Elites not mass produced)

Price match Hivestrains.

OR just copy paste Hivestrains like Brood Bros sort of like TechPriest? (Forgot the admech fixer in Militarum that uses forge worlds not Militarum.


On the other side of the fence if they just made a decent balanced book then we wouldn't have iconic units locked out because some Imperial Rules writer (Cruddex is that you?!) Is afraid his dolls will lose to aliens.

[hivemind03]

The did make a decently balanced book, aside from a few datasheets that were just a bit too pricey (vehicles mainly). Then they realized that the codex could win tournaments and they couldn't allow anything even Tyranid adjacent to be that good. So they beat the codex to death with nerfs.