Ynnari question now

[LordPathos]

Ynnari aren't that different from what they were in 7th, but I am not seeing anything that says that if I take <Craftworld> psykers in a Ynnari army, they can choose from the Revenant discipline. Are the Ynnarne and Yvraine the only ones that can do so?

Unrelated side note, I am so happy we have these new detachments for army building. Now I can make a Wraith only army without jumping through hoops. Happy days!

[No One]

LordPathos said:

Ynnari aren't that different from what they were in 7th, but I am not seeing anything that says that if I take <Craftworld> psykers in a Ynnari army, they can choose from the Revenant discipline. Are the Ynnarne and Yvraine the only ones that can do so?

No. If you pick up <Craftworld> with most other units being Ynnari, it's not a Ynnari army - it's a Aeldari army. So, <Craftworld> would still be Craftworlds, and would have to become Ynnari - in which they could take Ynnari powers, yes.

[LordPathos]

Pretty sure that since I pick things from the Craftworld, Dark Eldar, and Harlequin sections and they all gain the Ynnari keyword, then it is an Ynnari army if I so choose to use that faction keyword. Now is that any different from an Aeldari army? Nah. But that doesn't explain why a Farseer in an Ynnari army can pick Revenant powers.

[No One]

Yes - but if it's Ynnari, it's not <Craftworld>.

You can take an army if they all share Keywords, so (presumably), they all have Aeldari, so you could take them all as Aeldari, still being <Craftworld>, DE etc and having Battle Focus, PfP etc. Or, change their Keyword to Ynnari as it says - now a Ynnari army if they all have that Keyword, Ynnari can access Revenant, but can no longer access Runes of Battle (it's the same thing that happens with Dark Angels, say).

[LordPathos]

So if I take a Farseer and a Spiritseer in an Ynnari army, they lose access to their respective Runes and can only choose Revenant? I don't particularly like that. Is there page number I can reference? I was thinking I might as well make my Wraith army a Ynnari army because they don't get Battle Focus anyway, might as well get the Strength from Death. But if I have to give up Runes of Battle on the Spirit Seer, I probably won't do that.

[No One]

LordPathos said:

So if I take a Farseer and a Spiritseer in an Ynnari army, they lose access to their respective Runes and can only choose Revenant? I don't particularly like that. Is there page number I can reference? I was thinking I might as well make my Wraith army a Ynnari army because they don't get Battle Focus anyway, might as well get the Strength from Death. But if I have to give up Runes of Battle on the Spirit Seer, I probably won't do that.

Huh, on comparing to DA, I was wrong.

DA says that they take from Interomancy instead of Librarius. While there is no such caveat for Ynnari/Revenant (I just wrongly assumed that there was). So, yep - Runes of Fate/Battle as normal. And there's a Psychic tree that a whopping 2 models can access .



As an aside, I was not saying they'd lose it as part of a Ynnari army. Only if they specifically took the Ynnari Keyword (as opposed to, say, Ulthwé, and just have Aeldari as the common Keyowrd)- which, on rereading, I'm not sure you could do (since to be an X army, you have to all share that Keyword I'm pretty sure, and that's what it says you do).

[mattblowers]

Jun 27, 2017 10:28:52 GMT No One said:

As an aside, I was not saying they'd lose it as part of a Ynnari army. Only if they specifically took the Ynnari Keyword (as opposed to, say, Ulthwé, and just have Aeldari as the common Keyowrd)- which, on rereading, I'm not sure you could do (since to be an X army, you have to all share that Keyword I'm pretty sure, and that's what it says you do).

I don't see a reason to take a Yannari army over an Aelderi one. If I'm reading it right, just make the units you want Yannari and keep the rest Aelderi. Maybe when codexes come out there will be a reason, but for now, I think cherry picking units is probably the best way to go. Yannari is a choice but Aeldari is auto included with all types of Eldar.

[No One]

mattblowers said:

I don't see a reason to take a Yannari army over an Aelderi one. If I'm reading it right, just make the units you want Yannari and keep the rest Aelderi. Maybe when codexes come out there will be a reason, but for now, I think cherry picking units is probably the best way to go. Yannari is a choice but Aeldari is auto included with all types of Eldar.

See, I'm not sure you can do that. That was definitely what I though first time through (take anything you want with Soulburst with Ynnari, everyone else as base faction), but now I'm not too sure. Will post relevant quotes in a bit. Edit: Further reading, I'm back to my original position . Namely, I think I was adding meaning to "can be part of a Ynnari army" that doesn't exist. I was thinking that Ynnari would have to be the shared Faction Keyword for Ynnari to be the Army Faction, and thus for it to be a Ynnari army. But...A: I'm not sure if the first one is a thing. It's...not well explained what it means, outside of the 'must share Faction Keywords', which they do in Aeldari. (This also ties in to my issues with GSC/Nids/IG).
B: I don't think they're referring to Army Faction with that phrase, and it just being a general statement, rather than having rules meaning, as it were.

[LordPathos]

At first I thought it was like Grey Knights, they give you a list of units you can add to a GK chapter from the SM datasheets. They gain the GK special rules and if a psyker, it can only pick from Santic. I figured the 'list' of units you can bring in an Ynnari detachment was the entirety of the 3 other codices. Under that logic, then yes, any Craftworld or Harlequin psykers would lose their specific disciplines and could only use Revenant. I just felt that was odd since that wasn't the case in 7th. But since this is 8th and the ridiculous number of disciplines have been cut back, I wouldn't be surprised if it is one discipline or the other. I just want to read where it says that.

[No One]

As far as I can tell, it is only Runes of Fate/Battle. There is no mention on Revenant/Ynnari about Psykers being able to access Revenant that otherwise couldn't - the only ones who can are those who say they can i.e. Yncarne/Yvraine.

[mattblowers]

That's what I see too, psychic powers are set on the datasheet. I don't see anything that gives Yannari a work around. No One did you find anything that restricts what you can take? the only thing I can find is that all units have to share at least one faction keyword. They are all Aeldari. The Yannari add on only makes them give up the <Craftworld> designation and lose the PFP, Battle Focus, or Rising Crescendo rules on those units. Worse case scenario would be that they would have to be in seperate Force Orgs which isn't that big of a deal.

[LordPathos]

Here is something else I am not sure of. Say I make an Aeldari army. Can I say any Wraithguard/blades are Ynnari and everything else is Craftworld? Wraith units do not get Battle Focus and I don't need Ancient Doom for who I would play against. There is no reason to not take Wraith infantry as Ynnari so I can get Strength from Death. It is just weird how Ynnari works by taking things from other factions.

If I cannot do that, I think I know how I can get the army that I want regardless, just 2 separate detachments.
Vanguard Detachment with the Ynnari faction, bring the Yncarne because I wanted to anyway and nothing but Wraithguard/blades. If I really want another Ynnari psyker, maybe an extra Farseer. Because I want to use Wraithlords too, they can go into the Heavy Support slots.
Then a Craftworld Supreme Command detachment which would be my Wraithseer, 2 Spiritseers, and a Knight for the LoW.

Btw, how do 'allies' work this edition? Rules say everything in a detachment needs the same keyword. What is stopping me from having 1 detachment of Tyranids and 1 detachment of Eldar?

[mattblowers]

Jun 27, 2017 16:21:34 GMT LordPathos said:

Btw, how do 'allies' work this edition? Rules say everything in a detachment needs the same keyword. What is stopping me from having 1 detachment of Tyranids and 1 detachment of Eldar?

All armies have to share at least one keyword throughout. You can't even take Tyranids, GSC, and Astra Militarum because although GSC==Tyranids and GSC==AM, AM=/=Tyranids.

You can't have Yannari psykers outside of Yncarne and Yvraine as far as I can tell. The powers they can pick are outlined on their datasheet and they appear to be the only ones that are allowed.

[LordPathos]

I'm not seeing anything that says all detachments have to share the same faction, just all units within a single detachment have to.

[mattblowers]

Jun 27, 2017 18:14:05 GMT LordPathos said:

I'm not seeing anything that says all detachments have to share the same faction, just all units within a single detachment have to.

Pg. 214 ARMY FACTION section "All of the units in a matched play army, with the exception of those that are UNALIGNED must have at least one Faction keyword in common even though they may be in different detachments."