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Post by patsfan32 on Jan 31, 2013 20:01:04 GMT
Hello hive, Ive been curious since I have started playing a month or so ago about whether or not a cc only army could be viable. I want to try one out real bad but if it is going to make me hate life I may rethink it lol. My idea now utilizes a ton of hormys, some ymgarls, a cc kittes flyrant and a broodlord unit of genestealers. Possibly even some raveners and of course a trygon. So would an army like this work? I dont care if itd be hard as long as its possible. Thanks for your opinions in advanced!
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Post by Macradon on Jan 31, 2013 20:33:49 GMT
It's possible yeah, but Tervigons, you need tervigons!
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Post by jhussey on Jan 31, 2013 20:38:34 GMT
I personnally love a CC only nid army. I played one in 4th and 5th edition. It was harder in 5th and I had to add some guns to help. I haven't played my old army list in 6th yet. I've done alot of research and what not and it seems that a CC only army would have a hard time. I've played several 6th edition games now and as much as I would love to run a CC only army I haven't found it to be wise. I do run alot of CC units though. Raveners, Warriors with 2x ST, hormies, Flyrant with LW, BS and ST. But I find that they just get picked off too fast now since they cannot run and charge anymore. My raveners fair well though. They move fast enough and have a nice charge distance so they get into CC fast even without deep striking. Your opponent will most likely score first kill too, and since they will be shooting at you, you may not have much left to assault with. That being said I think that with enough troops and a few guns just for some distraction, it would be a fun way to try. The other thing would the synapse issue if your tyrant stays too far away from the hormies. If I may suggest, try your list and see how it plays, but add a Zoanthrope for at least one solid shooting and some synapse. The other thing I would be concerned with is tank busting. If your Tyrant and Trygon are tied up with two, an additional one would wreak havoc on your horde. All that being said I dont think it's impossible, but it would deffinately give you a workout.
Oh and I know Carnifex's are expensive and many people wont run them anymore, but maybe look into one too. I'd like to know how you do if you try this army, so let me know please!
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Post by eugee on Jan 31, 2013 21:57:22 GMT
It's definitely harder in 6E, but that doesn't mean it won't work. You just have to accept your limitations, if you go that route.
I went with a very CC heavy list in 5E, and there are definite shortcomings in 6E. My CC flyrant has become a dakka flyrant (they are just sooo good), but she's still a monster in CC. My main swarm is gargoyles, chased by hormagaunts, chased by devilgants and a Tervigon. Hive Guard & Biovores are in the back ranks (with the Tervigon). I'd still consider my list a CC army, as my flankers are the flyrant, a Trygon Prime, and Ymgarls. The real punch is those heavy CC units, and victory comes from just burying the enemy in a roiling melee.
Still, without the hive guard, devilgants, and biovores, I think my list would fall apart quickly.
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Post by Davor on Feb 1, 2013 0:22:24 GMT
What is stopping you from trying one out? Use counts as first, to try it out. Also IF you get slaughtered, learn from it and try again.
It's only a game. If you loose, so what? I loose all the time. All you can do is try it and see if you like it. People say shark, cat and dog taste really good. So does this mean you will try it? Most likely not. So if people say CC sucks and should be avoided, does that mean you will not do it?
I say try it, and learn from it, adapt for next game. After 5 games, if it does no good, then I say scrap it and not bother anymore.
I think I will try out a list almost like what you said for fun.
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Post by patsfan32 on Feb 1, 2013 3:31:19 GMT
It's possible yeah, but Tervigons, you need tervigons! Haha thats exactly why i want to avoid tervis completely, its either Tervis or gtfo and I hate that lol I personnally love a CC only nid army. I played one in 4th and 5th edition. It was harder in 5th and I had to add some guns to help. I haven't played my old army list in 6th yet. I've done alot of research and what not and it seems that a CC only army would have a hard time. I've played several 6th edition games now and as much as I would love to run a CC only army I haven't found it to be wise. I do run alot of CC units though. Raveners, Warriors with 2x ST, hormies, Flyrant with LW, BS and ST. But I find that they just get picked off too fast now since they cannot run and charge anymore. My raveners fair well though. They move fast enough and have a nice charge distance so they get into CC fast even without deep striking. Your opponent will most likely score first kill too, and since they will be shooting at you, you may not have much left to assault with. That being said I think that with enough troops and a few guns just for some distraction, it would be a fun way to try. The other thing would the synapse issue if your tyrant stays too far away from the hormies. If I may suggest, try your list and see how it plays, but add a Zoanthrope for at least one solid shooting and some synapse. The other thing I would be concerned with is tank busting. If your Tyrant and Trygon are tied up with two, an additional one would wreak havoc on your horde. All that being said I dont think it's impossible, but it would deffinately give you a workout. Oh and I know Carnifex's are expensive and many people wont run them anymore, but maybe look into one too. I'd like to know how you do if you try this army, so let me know please! I definitely will let you know as soon as i am able to use it on my next day off And thanks for recommending carnifexi lol I dont hear that near enough. This not being impossible is exactly what I wanted to hear! eugee; Ya taking the limits in to account will be the first thing I do, this will be a list made from the ground up to synergize with the strengths and minimize the weaknesses. Davor Nothing is stopping me lol I was going to do it regardless I just wanted to see what I was getting myself in to
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Post by patsfan32 on Feb 1, 2013 3:44:38 GMT
== HQ == Swarmlord Brood (340 pts.) Swarmlord (1) = 280 pts. Tyrant Guard (1) - Scything Talons = 60 pts. Tyranid Prime (1) - Pair Of Boneswords, Scything Talons, Regeneration = 100 pts.
== Elites == Ymgarl Genestealer Brood (5) = 115 pts. Zoanthrope Brood (2) = 120 pts.
== Troops == Broodlord Brood (118 pts.) Broodlord (1) - Scything Talons = 62 pts. Genestealer (4) = 56 pts. Hormagaunt Brood (14) - Toxin Sacs = 112 pts. Hormagaunt Brood (15) - Toxin Sacs = 120 pts.
== Heavy Support == Trygon Prime (1) - Containment Spines, Regeneration, Trygon Prime Upgrade = 265 pts. Carnifex (1) - Scything Talons x2, Bio-Plasma, Frag Spines, Regeneration = 210 pts.
== Total == 1500 pts.
ok this is the one list I have in mind, Im hoping it has enough threats that atleast someone can get in and do damage, The hormys are going to run right up the gut while my ymgarls, trygon and carnifex come from reserves turn 2 thanks to swarmy. The zoans will be rolled for biomancy and be buffers/debuffers, the swarmlord I may try for gate of infinity but not sure (Can you roll for powers from 2 different sections?) If so Id obviously be trying to get iron arm from biomancy and endurance, then try my luck at getting gate of infinity or invisibility. The brood lord will also roll for powers in hopes he gets telekine dome. With threats from every direction they Cant really afford to split their attention which means turn 2 if they focus my carni or my trygon they are getting tarpitted to hell by the hormys and hopefully the rest can mop up. In my head this works, and in particular I see this being good against Tau, which is who I will be playing against. I have another list in mind too which I may throw up depending on whats said about this one.
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Post by retnab on Feb 1, 2013 7:00:35 GMT
You are DEFINITELY going to want more than 5 Y-stealers and 4 G-stealers. In a 1500 pt game they will be mowed down way before they can get into combat as they're much more of a threat than the gaunts.
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Post by t⊗theark on Feb 1, 2013 7:13:59 GMT
It's possible but you're gonna need a whole heap of target saturation considerations to make sure all the cool things get across the board. Keep everything either around the same points cost or make them look really similar (take heaps of blob infantry if you're going infantry, stick to monsters if you're taking monsters), or try to make different units look about the same threat (it;s hard to choose to ignore either the brood of carnifexes, the squad of genestealers or the 30 hormagaunts).
If your oponent has a hard time with his target priorities than he'll tend to do more stupid stuff when shooting at you so more things will be alive to choppy chop chop when you get there.
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Post by Jabberwocky on Feb 1, 2013 7:58:12 GMT
The main problems you will face are extreme armies.
Super mobile or super shooty will just keep their distance and destroy you.
Balanced armies, you will do fine as some units will come toward you letting you cover more ground and keep you safe from their shooting.
I'd strongly suggest Ymgarls to tie up volume fire, raveners to close the gaps quickly, 2 Broodlord commandos for durable support troops, a big block (and I mean big) of hormies with TS and the Swarmlord with retinue.
If you go up toward 2k start adding in combat Flyrants so you can at least vectorstrike glance flyers and catch other fast moving targets.
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Post by glassiya on Feb 1, 2013 8:13:56 GMT
Haha thats exactly why i want to avoid tervis completely, its either Tervis or gtfo and I hate that lol Bro! ))) I started playing Nidz for a half-year ago or so. And I also tried to aim for CC, because it was cool, fluffy, and weapon biomorphs look qute awful (flesh-bolter, yeah) when compared with old-fashioned claws and talons. Still, few games caused me to review that concept to add some balance. For example, all kinds of Flyers are especially popular these days - and obviously, pure-CC army won't even scratch them. Second popular thing - Aegis, they just hide behind this cover and shoot all that approaches. So you're gonna think of what you're gonna do with such armies. Basically, I'd adviced you to divide your forces in two, to hide about a half in Deep Strike, Outflank, Dormant and such. So they won't have to run through the table and die. So 1st turn your main force (flyers, gargoyles and shrikes in here should do the trick)will go forward through cover, while on a 2nd/3rd all your reserves will come out at once, and overwhelm your enemy.Your can even use your Spores as a living wall to block the LoS to the newcomers. But this is only my opinion, of course. Anyway, if you're gonna run a pure CC army, I'm waiting for Battle Reports from you. This should be interesting. And - good luck, comrade.
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Post by patsfan32 on Feb 1, 2013 13:06:38 GMT
All of your suggestions are great thank you guys! I do see some tweaking that needs to be made to this list. I think I will throw up a revised list later when I am dobe work. I may just nix the carni for more ymgarls and free up some points for more broodlord commando units. Thanks for your feedback guys and Ill be sure to throw up a combat report as soon as I'm able to test out this list. (Hopefully tuesday). I love the swarmlors but I am toying with the idea of running two cc flyrants. Ill put more thought in to it and get back to you guys
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Post by Squire on Feb 1, 2013 13:54:17 GMT
Swarmlord with 2 tyrant guard 4 warriors with rending claws and scything talons 4 warriors with rending claws and scything talons 21 hormagaunts 21 hormagaunts 21 hormagaunts 3 carnifexes
1498 points
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Post by patsfan32 on Feb 1, 2013 14:43:11 GMT
Swarmlord with 2 tyrant guard 4 warriors with rending claws and scything talons 4 warriors with rending claws and scything talons 21 hormagaunts 21 hormagaunts 21 hormagaunts 3 carnifexes 1498 points I really like this list. I like all the hormagaunts lol. I may end up running something like this but I'd like to get raveners in there somehow. I may end up going an elite and fast kind of list. Ymgarls, raveners, a swarm star and broodlord commandos with points used up by warriors
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Post by patsfan32 on Feb 1, 2013 15:01:44 GMT
+++ cc nids (1499pts) +++
Selections:
Tyranids 5th Ed (2010) (Primary Detachment) Selections:
+ HQ + (335pts)
* Hive Tyrant (255pts) (Psyker, Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature) Bonded Exoskeleton, Hive Commander (25pts), Leech Essence, Paroxysm, 2x Scything Talons, Wings (60pts)
* Tyranid Prime (80pts) (Alpha warrior, Independant Character, Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature) Bonded Exoskeleton, Rending claws, Scything talons
+ Elites + (350pts)
* Ymgarl Genestealer Brood (115pts) * 5x Ymgarl Genestealer (115pts) (Alter Form, Brood Telepathy, Dormant, Fleet, Move Through Cover) 5x Hardened Carapace, 5x Rending Claws
* Ymgarl Genestealer Brood (115pts) * 5x Ymgarl Genestealer (115pts) (Alter Form, Brood Telepathy, Dormant, Fleet, Move Through Cover) 5x Hardened Carapace, 5x Rending Claws
* Zoanthrope Brood (120pts) * 2x Zoanthrope (120pts) (Psyker, Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature, Warp Field) 2x Claws and Teeth, 2x Reinforced Chitin, 2x Warp Blast, 2x Warp Lance
+ Troops + (489pts)
* Genestealer Brood (132pts) * Broodlord (62pts) (Brood Telepathy, Fleet, Infiltrate, Move Through Cover, Psyker) Aura of Despair, Hardened Carapace, Hypnotic Gaze, Rending Claws, Scything Talons (2pts) * 5x Genestealer (70pts) (Brood Telepathy, Fleet, Infiltrate, Move Through Cover) 5x Reinforced Chitin, 5x Rending Claws
* Genestealer Brood (132pts) * Broodlord (62pts) (Brood Telepathy, Fleet, Infiltrate, Move Through Cover, Psyker) Aura of Despair, Hardened Carapace, Hypnotic Gaze, Rending Claws, Scything Talons (2pts) * 5x Genestealer (70pts) (Brood Telepathy, Fleet, Infiltrate, Move Through Cover) 5x Reinforced Chitin, 5x Rending Claws
* Hormagaunt Brood (120pts) * 20x Hormagaunt (120pts) (Bounding Leap, Fleet, Instinctive Behaviour - Feed, Move Through Cover) 20x Chitin, 20x Scything Talons
* Tyranid Warrior Brood (105pts) * 3x Tyranid Warrior (105pts) (Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature) 3x Hardened Carapace, 3x Rending Claws (15pts), 3x Scything talons
+ Fast Attack + (325pts)
* Ravener Brood (150pts) * 5x Ravener (150pts) (Acute Senses, Deep Strike, Instinctive Behaviour - Feed, Move Through Cover) 5x Scything Talons, 5x Scything Talons
* Tyranid Shrike Brood (175pts) * 5x Tyranid Shrike (175pts) (Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature) 5x Devourer, 5x Reinforced Chitin, 5x Scything talons, 5x Wings
Profile Summary:
Name Unit Type WS BS S T W I A LD Save Pg Reference Broodlord Infantry 7 0 5 5 3 7 4 10 4+ 40 Genestealers Infantry 6 0 4 4 1 6 2 10 5+ 40 Hive Tyrant Monstrous Creature 8 3 6 6 4 5 4 10 3+ 34 Hormagaunt Infantry 3 3 3 3 1 5 2 6 6+ 38 Ravener Beast 5 3 4 4 3 5 4 6 5+ 37 Tyranid Prime Infantry 6 4 5 5 3 5 4 10 3+ 36 Tyranid Shrike Jump Infantry 5 3 4 4 3 4 3 10 5+ 36 Tyranid Warrior Infantry 5 3 4 4 3 4 3 10 4+ 36 Ymgarl Genestealer Infantry 6 0 4 4 1 6 2 10 4+ 61 Zoanthrope Infantry 3 4 4 4 2 3 1 10 5+ 44
Name RangeStrength AP Type Pg Reference Devourer 18" 4 -Assault 3* 81
Selection Rule Summary:
* Acute Senses * Alpha warrior * Alter Form * Bounding Leap * Brood Telepathy * Deep Strike * Dormant * Fleet * Independant Character * Infiltrate * Instinctive Behaviour - Feed * Move Through Cover * Psyker * Shadow in the Warp * Synapse Creature * Warp Field
Created with BattleScribe did this with battlescribe on my phone sorry its so dense ><. But ya I like the spwed of this list so this is probably what I will go with. May drop the warriors to put the g stealers in spores but probably not
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