My meta is going up; whither the Skavenids?

[commandersasha]

My friends are getting more fliers. I now see a second Vendetta, a second Heldrake and a second Dakkajet, and there were always two Stormravens. (No Necrons, fortunately!)

I want to give my friends good games, with the models they are proud of.
I don't want to start a new army; I love my Skavenids!

I play friendly-competitive games, with a group of friends who go to tournaments occasionally.

What should I do? My current list of models is:
Tyrant, Flyrant, Prime
3 Zoes, 3 Hive Guard, 10 Ymgarls, Doom
1 Terv, 50 Terms
20 Horms, 20 Genies
20 Gargs, 3 Shrikes, Harpy, 6 Raveners
1 Dakkafex, 1 Trygon, 3 Biovores

and 2 Spores

I don't want to just ignore the fliers, nor win by attrition with Terv spam, but I am really struggling against those pesky birds!

We usually play 1,500, so should I look at a second Flyrant, another Dakkafex...Skypad...? As an all-proxy army, any biomorphs can be added without problems!

How are you dealing with flier-rich environments?

[fragile]

Flyrants and HG will be your best bets at taking down Fliers.

[rampagingfex]

Dakkajets, Helldrakes, and Vendettas can be shot on rear armor, so Flyrants and Devourer Fexes in pods are good... but unfortunately I haven't got a solution for the Stormraven yet except ignore it or hope it goes into skimmer mode.

I've heard some stories that objuration mechanicum can do something useful against vehicles, so maybe take a look at being flexible with your Zoanthrope and Tervigon powers...I'd probably stick with Biomancy on Flyrants looking for Endurance and Iron Arm. If you get a couple of those maledictions, coupled with the shooting you do have, you have a good chance to start knocking them down.

In the end, I'd probably look at a second Flyrant, and then use all the tactics as they apply (psychic powers, spore fex, hive guard, etc...)

-RF

[infornography]

Yeah, second Flyrant is almost going to be required to deal with those Storm Ravens at least. It is after all our only skyfire with high enough strength non-blast/template shooting to even hurt a storm raven.

Everything else is going to miss 5/6ths of the time and therefore will be at dramatically decreased effectiveness against flyers and in most cases would be better utilized firing at ground targets.

[boomerz]

aegis defense line, it has interceptor... sure...BS 2, but it has twin linked. Also, you could try starting your flyrants in reserve and taking the bottom of the turn so they fly in after your opponents and shoot them down.

[infornography]

Aegis defense line does not have autofire. Only emplaced weapons have autofire, not gun emplacements. Why Games Workshop, why did you create two types of things with such absurdly similar names?

[Jabberwocky]

Also, we can't use either type of guns now since the FAQ was updated.

[boomerz]

oh, my bad, i never use any of that junk, i just rock 3 flyrants in 2k+ games so anti air isnt usually a problem.

[commandersasha]

So, my thoughts so far for a non-Tervigon-spam list for a flier-rich environment are, at 1,500:

3Hiveguard, 3Biovores and a Prime, LWBS, Personal Warlord
(mobile heavy fire base unit, middle of table)

3 Zoes in a Spore
Doom Spore

Tervigon with Adr,Tox,CC, 2nd power, rolling on Biomancy
16 Devilgaunts in a Spore

15 UberGoyles
Dakkafex in spore

4 spores means I should get good board control; my HG/BV fire base has been very effective so far; Spored Zoe's and a hidden Prime should keep Synapse until end of game.

What do you think? This list means I only need to build 2 spores.

[commandersasha]

I am keen to stick to a single all-comers list amongst my friends, and as I play the CSM guy most, I see those 2Heldrakes a lot; one of those can usually remove my Flyrant in a turn, so I'm not sure a 2nd Flyrant would be much better.

[coredump]

If you don't want to run Tervs, that is fine. But don't avoid them just because they 'only win by attrition'. They are often a decent answer to flyer lists, and are a perfectly valid army composition. Much of 6E is moving towards resiliency, and Tervs give that two ways. Plus, we really don't have many options against flyers. The only decent choice is a flyrant.... everything else starts at poor and moves to bad and terrible. Horde's, however, are a valid counter, especially for Supersonic flyers.