How can lictors be used effectively?

[blind[tyrant]guardian]

We all want to run lictors, but they just don't seem to be effective enough in order to use them over ymgarls. is there any way to have them be a threat?

[halos]

Lictors are cool, and the model is nice, nicer than genestealers, so that's a plus over Ymgarls I guess.

In seriousness though they are quite difficult to use with any degree of usefulness. Pros include their better cover save thanks to Stealth, access to Assault Grenades, reasonable Strength and ability to deploy wherever you like them. I guess they have pheromone trail too but it's not useful all that often.

Ymgarls on the other hand have the better armour save and, most importantly, the ability to charge when they arrive.

Lictors I find are best used to scare off backfield artillery or heavy support units. A cany opponent will be aware of the threat of Ymgarls and deploy such units far away from area terrain, Lictors have no such stipulation and can be deployed safely out of LoS for a turn, forcing your opponent to either move the threatend unit (reducing it's firepower) or ignore the Lictors and suffer the consequences next turn.

Mostly though apart from a few unlikely circumstances where lack of area terrain becomes an issue Ymgarls perform better thanks to their ability to instantly tie up a squad or wreck a vehicle when they appear.

[ZergLord]

Sept 16, 2012 6:05:02 GMT blind[tyrant]guardian said:

We all want to run lictors, but they just don't seem to be effective enough in order to use them over ymgarls. is there any way to have them be a threat?

Unfortunately no.

You can threaten heavy vehicles and heavy weapon infantry units, but Ymgarls can do that too. And they can move and assault the turn they arrive. In the previous edition they at least could've get a 3+ cover Save very easily, but not anymore.

Use Deathleaper instead. Offensively less efficient (which is irrelevant) but can harrass your opponent if used properly.

[fragile]

Well they can be a threat. They a disruptive element rather than an effective one. Meaning that if you deploy them in cover near something important your opponent must do something to deal with them and cannot ignore them. This means much less firepower directed at something else coming across the board at them.

[wisdomseyes1]

Deathleaper is a pretty cool guy who isnt afraid of anything...

Okay I was GOING to just leave my post like that but I compulsively have to elaborate so I dont sound like a moron. Just know I dont feel in the mood for typing right now so my post will feel very... unorganized and choppy.

Deathleaper has stealth and shrouded (stealth from basic rules, shrouded from FAQ). This means he gets +3 to coversaves, for a 4+ coversave in open ground and 2+ coversave in most terrain. The deathleaper is a pretty cool guy who can absorb fire if the opponent doesnt already think that it is a bad model.

Deathleaper has the rule "its after me". A seemingly useless ability that hits psykers or any character that relies on its leadership hard. So long as its alive, that librarian is only passing leadership tests 50% of the time, rather than 92% (assuming you got a 3 on a D3)

Deathleaper makes difficult terrain very hard to move through. Now, suddenly that area terrain that the heavy weapons team was in, they are going to be moving D6" rather than their more consistent 2D6 or 3D6 if they have move through cover (which only happens on warlord traits). This makes the deathleaper even more useful at targeting heavy weapons teams, since area terrain IS difficult by default.

Where did it go? THIS is something that is just plain awesome. Why? because you keep the deathleaper in reserves and it will stay there forevermore if you so wish it. It can disappear and come back into the game the next turn anywhere you want for it to. This means right on top of an objective your opponent is holding, using the deathleaper as a denial unit.

And then the deathleapers stats are pretty fun too! WS9, non assault units hit him on 5's. I7 and assault grenades, the dealleaper hits first. Rending 5+ he is going to kill some stuff pretty easily. S6 he wounds most things pretty well. The biggest issue is that his save is pretty abysmal and he doesnt have a whole lot of attacks (for a tyranid model he doesnt)

deathleaper is the lictor you want to use. Lictors arent all that great because they dont really have anything to add to the army that other units dont do better. Both lictors and the deathleaper are only good at killing off weak units and tying the opponents weak shooting units down. That makes them unappealing in some situations, but makes them great for mindgames. And if they are ignored, they can do some damage or negatively effect the opponents game.

I know you were asking about lictors but lictors are not the (please do not swear). Talonis, however, might have some tips for you.

[jofan32]

Silly question how does the deathleaper make open ground difficult terrain ??

[swarmy]

Sept 16, 2012 15:30:49 GMT fragile said:

Well they can be a threat. They a disruptive element rather than an effective one. Meaning that if you deploy them in cover near something important your opponent must do something to deal with them and cannot ignore them. This means much less firepower directed at something else coming across the board at them.

Not to mention knowing when to go to ground or not with that sweet 2+ cover save inside of area terrain/ruins if you can draw their attention.

[wisdomseyes1]

Sept 16, 2012 20:28:00 GMT jofan32 said:

Silly question how does the deathleaper make open ground difficult terrain ??

See, this is EXACTLY what I meant when I said I was tired and didnt feel like typing.

They make difficult terrain very cumbersome, editing my post now.

Sept 16, 2012 22:29:30 GMT swarmy said:

Sept 16, 2012 15:30:49 GMT fragile said:

Well they can be a threat. They a disruptive element rather than an effective one. Meaning that if you deploy them in cover near something important your opponent must do something to deal with them and cannot ignore them. This means much less firepower directed at something else coming across the board at them.

Not to mention knowing when to go to ground or not with that sweet 2+ cover save inside of area terrain/ruins if you can draw their attention.

Going to ground usually creates the exact opposite of "drawing attention" actually. Not sure if thats what you were saying but it sounded like it.

[jofan32]

Ah right nice one :-)

[swarmy]

Sept 17, 2012 0:28:34 GMT wisdomseyes1 said:

Sept 16, 2012 20:28:00 GMT jofan32 said:

Silly question how does the deathleaper make open ground difficult terrain ??

See, this is EXACTLY what I meant when I said I was tired and didnt feel like typing.

They make difficult terrain very cumbersome, editing my post now.



Not to mention knowing when to go to ground or not with that sweet 2+ cover save inside of area terrain/ruins if you can draw their attention.

Going to ground usually creates the exact opposite of "drawing attention" actually. Not sure if thats what you were saying but it sounded like it.

If you want to draw the fire back *off* them it certainly works to deter them from wasting shots. I've done it to decent effect before when I needed the pheromone trail. I should have added that stipulation. Sorry wisdom

[ranmafan]

Don't forget that in the latest FAQs, unique models (deathleaper included) now count as characters - you can challenge any other character in the opponent's list as well, if you charge them.

[blind[tyrant]guardian]

does this mean my swarmlord can join my unit of warriors?

[immortalblue]

Sept 24, 2012 17:29:06 GMT blind[tyrant]guardian said:

does this mean my swarmlord can join my unit of warriors?

no. Only INDEPENDENT characters can join units.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using proboards

[Talonis]

I'm late but here!!

I have used them pretty successfully last edition, for pages of reports, tactics and game plays click my link and browse through at your leisure

I have not updated it to 6th ed, but they remain largely the same. Just be even more cautious of flamers when charging now. If you can, pop up closest to the flamer and you could try to Flesh hook them out of the unit (kill them). Deathleaper is far better at this, as on a 6 to hit he can choose the flamer (if in range).

The golden rule I always tell people, just because you can appear 1" away, doesnt mean you have too. You know they can not charge the turn they arrive, so plan a turn ahead and get them into position. You can use them to help finish a unit already in combat, start a combat then hit and run out while gants/other units finish it off.

Deathleaper is amazing, as others have already said, but so many people underestimate the power 3 Lictors have. It is a lot of money and isnt as easy to throw at all targets as say a Devilfex of Hive guard, but against the right units, they are deadly and capable of handling their own.

But check out my Restoring the Fear thread, its all about Lictors/Deathleaper.

[coredump]

Sept 24, 2012 20:12:39 GMT Talonis said:

I'm late but here!!

Whew, that was close. Another day and I would have stared calling hospitals to see what happened.....