Flyrants, los and screens

[free]

Hi,

A couple of questions regarding how to keep my flyrant alive until he gets into h2h combat:

Can I screen my Swooping Flyrant with Gargoyles? My guess is not...

Can I fly (I mean SWOOP) him behind buildings to block los? My guess is not...

So if I swoop him he can be shot from anywhere (independently of los) as long as he is in range?

[Moontyranid]

no(and why),yes,yes

[free]

Moontyranid Thanks for the reply but how can it be yes to both the last two questions?

If I swoop my flyrant to end up behind a building (ie no los from/to enemy units) they can still fire at him and he at them, right?

[Moontyranid]

you need los to pick a target

[Moontyranid]

if the enemy has los on your tyrant they can shoot it as long they are in range.
PS wings dont count for los

[Jabberwocky]

You only need to obscure 25% of your model from 1 or more models viewpoint in the firing unit. Gargs should achieve this in most cases, especially since the wings are ignored for LoS/cover purposes.

Everything bar special rules (barrage, hiveguard, etc) needs LoS to shoot so if the Flyrant can't be seen at all (ignoring the wings) them they can't shoot him.

Remember also when swooping you can dive to gain 5+ jink, the same as cover from a screen. If you intend to assault the following turn anyway, then this is often worth doing.

[free]

Aug 23, 2012 9:14:51 GMT Jabberwocky said:

You only need to obscure 25% of your model from 1 or more models viewpoint in the firing unit. Gargs should achieve this in most cases, especially since the wings are ignored for LoS/cover purposes.

Everything bar special rules (barrage, hiveguard, etc) needs LoS to shoot so if the Flyrant can't be seen at all (ignoring the wings) them they can't shoot him.

So he gets cover and can hide out of los even if he is swooping?

[guns]

People are giving you vague answers (but to be fair, you posed your question in a vague way ). I understand what you're asking, though.

To everybody else; the OP is assuming that a Swooping FMC is no longer considered to occupy it's physical location on the board, because it's "flying" at a height greater than any models or terrain present on the table. I believe Skimmers had a rule along these lines, in either 3rd or 4th edition.

However, as intuitively correct as this concept may seem, it has no support whatsoever in the rules. It was one of the first things I checked when I got my rulebook. So, to answer the OP's question, yes, you CAN screen your FMC with any other models or terrain that cover 25% of it. The answer to your third question is no; TLoS always applies, no matter what movement mode the FMC is using. No enemy units can see him unless they have LoS. It may not feel "fluffy" but that's how the rules work. If you want you can imagine a swoop as a rising and diving trajectory, rather than a single vector at one elevation.

[ferro]

Well said, guns.
Indeed, your "flying" MC in swoop mode is still just a model on the table, and would receive the standard 5+ cover save just having his base touching area terrain, even if his body is completely out in the open. All the normal rules apply.

[free]

guns You understood exactly what I was asking and thanks for that very precise answer! As you probably understand English is not my first language, so I apologise for being vague.

So then I have a follow up question: Am I allowed to model my flyrant other than in the flying pose of the official model or on a flying base? My flyrant is standing (as I thought it looked so much cooler) but it doesnt seem entirely fair now...


Ahh, and one more thing, area terrain then is treated as for any other model also for the flyrant, right?

[coredump]

Mine is standing also, it is the same flyrant I have used for a few years now.

[angeleania]

I have two, one new model one the old HT with some old wings on, all metal. The HT will benefit from all cover just as if any other model, even fliers get cover if LOS is blocked enough. Due to the area terrain rules if the model is touching or in it, then it benefits from that cover.

In most cases with a little thought its easy to at least give your HT a chance using some form of cover. be beware, if you get hit then you could crash. It just a hit not a wound and you check for each unit that rolls the 6's to hit. If you fail that roll then jink and cover mean nothing you take that wound.... though its str 9 they still need to actually roll to wound, a 1 will save you that.