YStealers.

[core6188]

wow, you guys get really heated sometimes. While I do agree with coredump, you guys would do well to remember that these rule books, FAQ, ect... are all written by humans and not the great Influence of the Hive Mind as we deserve. And due to the fact there are so many writers there are going to be somethings lost in translation. So, I'd say your best bet is to discuss this topic with your local tournament judge or group of friends and see where they stand. If you go at the discussion from a non-bias direction you will most commonly get a non-bias answer back. Good Luck

[rehkal]

Heated indeed, but what can we say? We like to argu.... Discuss, our points thoroughly and vehem.. Uhh... Passionately. Yea, that's it.

Interesting points on ystealers being characters though, if true and they can issue challenges.... Makes them one hell of a good choice to bog down enemy units. Provided they don't get cut down too quickly.

[moonreaper]

I LOVE ystealers. They are amazing in what they do (especially since in 6th, they are almost the only ones assaulting from reserves) and incredibly useful for disruption, objective support or behind the enemy lines work of fear.

However I have an important question for 6th.
In 5th you could make the stealers appear just touching the boundaries of the area terrain and not having their whole base inside the area terrain boundaries. It was the whole idea that "within" is the base touching the range, like models getting an extra inch of movement from disembariking becaouse they touched the 2 inch range and gain their base size range as bonus.
What about in 6th, can we still make the ystealers appear just by touching (sligthly inside) with their base the area terrain boundaries?
If we cant, ystealers are USELESS because most of the time the area terrain isnt that large to accomodate 10 man stealers squads especially if the site is guarded.

[Psychichobo]

That's why you don't take 10 man Yealer squads. Just go for 7-8 and generally you should be fine, unless your area terrain isn't that big.

[moonreaper]

are you implying that in 6th, ystealers can ONLY enter the game when their full base is totally inside the boundaries of the area terrain? That is different from 5th . Do you have a reference or reasoning behind this? Its important for the use of the ystealers (game changing actually, from useful to horrible)

[gigasnail]

i haven't seen anything to make me think their bases would have to be completely enclosed by the terrain in 6th. i'm at work w/o my BRB, so if someone can find it please sauce/chapter/verse because i'd like to see it.

[wisdomseyes1]

The suggestion is that the terrain is "public property" and enemy models can occupy it.

Y genes can't come into play within 1" of enemy models.

Ps: I brought it up at my GW, and it took almost no time to convince them that they are characters. This makes me want to retract my statement of saying they are simply because these are the people at my GW...

[coredump]

"USELESS"??

You can fit 10 Yealers in a space 2" by 5", or about 3" by 3"; what area terrain are you using that "most of the time" isn't that big?? Even a small 6x6 piece would fit your brood 4 times over.

Putting your panic infused hyperbole aside.... there is no rule requiring them to be 'completely' within the area terrain. At least none I have found.

[demoric]

Well this thread has convinced me to use some greestuff and convert 8 of my 32 regular genestealers to try in 6th. Back in 5th I always felt they were too expensive and regular stealers were just dreaded by my opponents I saw no need. Now in 6th I feel the price difference may be justified.

[moonreaper]

Aug 27, 2012 23:01:47 GMT coredump said:

"USELESS"??

You can fit 10 Yealers in a space 2" by 5", or about 3" by 3"; what area terrain are you using that "most of the time" isn't that big?? Even a small 6x6 piece would fit your brood 4 times over.

Putting your panic infused hyperbole aside.... there is no rule requiring them to be 'completely' within the area terrain. At least none I have found.

Its not hyperbole. Any enemy model occypying the area terrain lowers your chances incredibly. I tried both methods (completely inside- just touching). The difference is incredible. I couldnt use the ystealers as I wanted with them appearing completely inside the A.T., where I could regularly make them appear even in guarded terrain and be very very useful.

Doesnt matter of course, it seems even in 6th they can appear just touching (overlapping it by a molecule) the terrain which makes them retain their "massive boon" status. I also love how you can morph to T5 before the overwatch if you want to raise your chances.

[Jestar]

Aug 28, 2012 5:55:18 GMT moonreaper said:

Aug 27, 2012 23:01:47 GMT coredump said:

"USELESS"??

You can fit 10 Yealers in a space 2" by 5", or about 3" by 3"; what area terrain are you using that "most of the time" isn't that big?? Even a small 6x6 piece would fit your brood 4 times over.

Putting your panic infused hyperbole aside.... there is no rule requiring them to be 'completely' within the area terrain. At least none I have found.

Its not hyperbole. Any enemy model occypying the area terrain lowers your chances incredibly. I tried both methods (completely inside- just touching). The difference is incredible. I couldnt use the ystealers as I wanted with them appearing completely inside the A.T., where I could regularly make them appear even in guarded terrain and be very very useful.

Doesnt matter of course, it seems even in 6th they can appear just touching (overlapping it by a molecule) the terrain which makes them retain their "massive boon" status. I also love how you can morph to T5 before the overwatch if you want to raise your chances.

Useless? Pffftt!!! I've always played them that they have to be inside the terrain, I interpreted the rule that way, never even dreamed it could be better, and I've always done well regardless. Picking the right piece of terrain and anticipating your opponent is the biggest challenge with Ymgarls, and once you get used to that, it's childs play.

[labinnac]

I do have a question about that enemies can't be within one inch. Is that one inch of them the unit or the entire terrain they are appearing out of? Either way they are a killing machine. already have friends trying to think of ways to deal with them.

[voraciousapathy]

There is no way to deal with Y-Stealers -- they are like Grey Knight Interceptors. Just accept the fact that they're going to appear, somewhere, and assault (and probably annihilate) something, and try to work around it. At the very least, they stall the enemy advance because they make people afraid to go near any terrain.

Best of all, they're placed after deployment, and can still assault when they show up from reserves.

Then, morph T5, give them Endurance (or Catalyst), and Preferred Enemy (Swarmlord), and maybe even Invisibility (Swarmlord again). Throw your Ymgarl Terminator 'Stealers with T5, 2+ Cover, 5+ Feel No Pain, Fearless, Preferred Enemy, and All Enemies Hit Us on 5's in Close Combat Because We're Invisible at.. err, basically anything short of Draigowing or Nob Bikers. Watch the enemy squad melt, rinse, repeat.

[moonreaper]

Aug 28, 2012 9:50:20 GMT labinnac said:

I do have a question about that enemies can't be within one inch. Is that one inch of them the unit or the entire terrain they are appearing out of? Either way they are a killing machine. already have friends trying to think of ways to deal with them.

from them

[coredump]

The one I like is the +S upgrade, Furious charge from Swarmlord, and the enfeeble on the target unit. Will now ID nobs and paladins etc. (Or scarab farms even without enfeeble.)