Are MC's back?

[scorpio]

Thanks guys

[nurglitch]

ilnar:

Sure, if you're an idiot. It's pretty simple. Take the Prisoner's Dilemma, simplified for easy comprehension: We each have the choice of either giving each other $2 or taking $1 for ourselves. If we both give, then we both get $2. If we both take, then we both get $1. If one gives while the other takes, the taker gets $3 while the giver gets $0.

You can try all the mind games you want, but the only rational move is to take. Similarly with high level Chess and Poker. The players aren't playing mind games, they're managing the odds in their favour during a game.

[ilnar]

You manage to make the most ridiculous connections,
A large part of chess is faint and counter faint, Bluff and double bluff, appearing strong in one part of the board only to strike from another.
The definition of managing odds in poker is deciding if your opponents are lying, and managing your own lies so no one doubs you,
If you play poker with only the cards in your hand, you are a poor player.

The game is all about managing risks, so you try and look strong where you are weak ect.
A terranofex charging forward with an acid spray is a terrifying prospect to a guard gun line, and receives much fire, even if you simply mean it to be a diversion for the real threat,
You cannot disregard the mental aspect of the game,

[sporesprayer]

Two days ago my double flying hive tyrants absorbed the shooting from an entire tau army for 3 turns allowing the rest of my army to move up the field under fire from a minimum of enemies (double hammerhead blasts) mind games are most definately useful.... read any book about tactics another example (in 5th) I deployed a trygon and forgot to move him all game ( (I had become sloppy drunk while the game before mine went on) but it kept a bubble of 18" away from him for the entire enemy army.

IMHO any MC that can roll on the biomancy table is totally worth it. Tervigons, HTs benefit greatly from powers 1,3, and 5 which with two powers each its good odds your getting SOMETHING on each one (they r the +d3 s/t, FNP/It Will Not Die/Eternal Warrior, +d3 a/i) my army is going to consist of mostly these things until GW does something. I cant believe they will let flying s9 t9 hive tyrants continue?

[liquid405]

Jul 4, 2012 19:55:54 GMT sporesprayer said:

I cant believe they will let flying s9 t9 hive tyrants continue?

The rareness and pure RNG of getting this combo makes it not worth accounting for.

[Inquisitor Stingray]

When were MC's out?

[webebuggin]

Game yesterday: triple dakkafex, once again invisble from swarm lord. I laughed all the way across the board with 2+ cover save from screening. I have not even come close to losing a game yet in 6th. There is no counter to invisible fex.

[nocturnalreaper]

So what are the best/ unbeatable combos for monstrous creatures at this point. Is Swarmlord now worth it. Should we spam the same monsters or run varied ones?

[infornography]

I can tell you one of my most successful lists in 5th was a nidzilla list.

[Space is pretty big]

A large part of chess is faint and counter faint, Bluff and double bluff, appearing strong in one part of the board only to strike from another.

Where do people always seem to get this idea of chess... Chess masters are delightfully honest about how chess works, the truth is it really just comes down to not being the first one to make a mistake.

Thus why a super computer beat the best chess players in the world. The computer didn't intuit the players feelings, he saw all possible courses of action and chose the best approach.

Once you put aside the glamor of trying to make a strategy game into poker, the only true opponent you have is your own imperfection. That you vs. yourself is kinda a fascinating event.


OT: Yeah fexs still suck for their point cost. It's really just Flyrant and Harpy that saw the most in terms of additional boost.

As for T-fex and Mawloc they're not significantly enough better to warent choosing them over Trygon, or tervigon, who though less cool are more dependable.

[coredump]

If you want to cheese the fex, don't conga line, just add a Prime.

At this point, you can wound allocate like crazy. I hate the rule, but currently it is in place.

[vivi22]

Jul 4, 2012 19:17:40 GMT nurglitch said:

ilnar:

Sure, if you're an idiot. It's pretty simple. Take the Prisoner's Dilemma, simplified for easy comprehension: We each have the choice of either giving each other $2 or taking $1 for ourselves. If we both give, then we both get $2. If we both take, then we both get $1. If one gives while the other takes, the taker gets $3 while the giver gets $0.

You can try all the mind games you want, but the only rational move is to take. Similarly with high level Chess and Poker. The players aren't playing mind games, they're managing the odds in their favour during a game.

Not that I necessarily agree with the idea of losing inches trying to do some funky wound allocation with Carnifex, but Prisoner's Dilemma doesn't rely apply here since it grossly over simplifies the number, and valuation, of the options available on any given person's turn, and assumes everyone is rational. If there's one thing human beings frequently aren't it's rational.

If you're going to honestly tell me that every move every intelligent, knowledgeable opponent you've ever played has been 100% rational and based on a careful weighing of the probabilities, odds, and objective threat presented by your units then I have to question if you've ever played a game with people before. Sometimes people miss things. Sometimes they can get tunnel vision because of one specific threat to the point of ignoring everything else. Sure, it doesn't always happen, but it does sometimes. And I can guarantee that there are many chess and poker players who do try and get into their opponents heads. When you're playing a game, you're never playing against probabilities alone, you're also playing the person across the table.

[Davor]

Jul 4, 2012 20:49:52 GMT webebuggin said:

Game yesterday: triple dakkafex, once again invisble from swarm lord. I laughed all the way across the board with 2+ cover save from screening. I have not even come close to losing a game yet in 6th. There is no counter to invisible fex.

Is this legal? Didn't check rule book yet, but does the SL have to be with the Carnifex as a unit to do this? If so, then it's not possible since a SL CAN'T join anyone except TG.

What rule and what is the page number it's on so I can read up on this.

[gloomfang]

Jul 5, 2012 0:52:33 GMT Davor said:

Is this legal? Didn't check rule book yet, but does the SL have to be with the Carnifex as a unit to do this? If so, then it's not possible since a SL CAN'T join anyone except TG.

What rule and what is the page number it's on so I can read up on this.

Sure its on Pg. 423.

Invisability: Blessing that targets one friendly unit within 24".

So take swarmloard. Roll 4 times on the Telepathy table. Hope you get Invisability. You have a 66% chance to get it. Not the greatest of odds. However it has two Warpcharge 2 powers. And SL the only guy in our army who can use them. Both are nasty. If you get mental fortitude dump it for the primaris power.

[Doc Ruby]

Jul 5, 2012 5:02:35 GMT gloomfang said:

Jul 5, 2012 0:52:33 GMT Davor said:

Is this legal? Didn't check rule book yet, but does the SL have to be with the Carnifex as a unit to do this? If so, then it's not possible since a SL CAN'T join anyone except TG.

What rule and what is the page number it's on so I can read up on this.

Sure its on Pg. 423.

Invisability: Blessing that targets one friendly unit within 24".

So take swarmloard. Roll 4 times on the Telepathy table. Hope you get Invisability. You have a 66% chance to get it. Not the greatest of odds. However it has two Warpcharge 2 powers. And SL the only guy in our army who can use them. Both are nasty. If you get mental fortitude dump it for the primaris power.

Should be much higher than 66% since you re-roll stuff you've already picked up (assuming you never take the primarius power)

1/6 + 1/5 + 1/4 + 1/3 = w/e math equation is needed to figure out probability.