8th Edition role change

[Hive Bahamut]

So now that we have all had some time to digest the new indexes (well at least chew on,) I was curious if there were any of our Nids or Cult units that have changed their desired role.

For example:

Swarmlord went from an expensive preferred enemy buff, to a monster in combat that just happens to make stuff faster.

Another example I can think of is Biovores. They were gentle harassers at best, and now they are a great cleanup squad.

Zoanthropes went from literally floating batteries, to having a reliable form of mortal wounds.

Ìm doing my best to dump all my old tactics and rules and come into 8th a new player, but it has been difficult not to compare.

Are there any that you have noticed? Are there any new roles? Now that Venomthrope aren't auto include, is there anything that does zero damage as MVP?

[cypheon]

I kinda want to pod in three tyrannofexes with fleshborer hives.. pop up a trygon prime for synapse. 60 shots in range turn 1, 120 turn 2+, and they look like they can soak up the hits while everything else runs up for CC

[gigasnail]

Zoanthropes are just durable synapse that sometimes does mortal wounds.

[gigasnail]

I dunno tfex is worth it in any configuration. Too pricey aND not enough output. Reasonably tough though.

Exocrine worth it, for sure.

Melee flyrant went from wishlist joke to assassin. Still a bully.

Dakka flyrant, time will tell. ST and deathspitters and auto smite and catalyst is a pretty well rounded MC, and let's you bounce out of combat to shoot at the cost of just one ST cc attack.

Venomthrope is kind of eh, cost went way up having to take a brood and only buff infantry. Still gives a buff to gants, which look solid and tough to budge when backed up by a tervigon.

Lots to go over.

[No One]

gigasnail said:

Dakka flyrant, time will tell. ST and deathspitters and auto smite and catalyst is a pretty well rounded MC, and let's you bounce out of combat to shoot at the cost of just one ST cc attack.

Honestly, RC over ST for a single - 30 pts less and arguably better (reroll all wounds vs reroll 1s to hit. Less consistent Dam, but still).

[Davor]

Tfex not enough out put? 40 shots for one mini? Am I missing something here? Remember I was never good at the rules so trying to learn a new edition now. I thought 40 shots was something good.

[nidzy]

Jun 6, 2017 1:29:20 GMT gigasnail said:

Zoanthropes are just durable synapse that sometimes does mortal wounds.

Yeah the free upgrade for the neurothrope almost has me buying one of the plastic kits for these. Zoanthropes have a chance to be super durable with the higher base wounds and wounds back from spirit leech.


I think the Mawloc became the distraction Carnifex.

I have been too busy thinking about how much better things seem to fit how I imagined playing with them. I can't wait to absorb a charge with gargoyles and then fly out of it the next round to get out of the way for my Monsters to hit. And just plunking down lictors whenever it feels right and hoping the charge goes off.

I think the Crone evolved into a back line soft target harasser. In 7th I used it to shoot haywire and try to vector strike vehicles/flyers. I think it will do better against infantry in this edition, or to get close and absorb overwatch for other fast movers.

[inferno]

Jun 6, 2017 2:15:54 GMT Davor said:

Tfex not enough out put? 40 shots for one mini? Am I missing something here? Remember I was never good at the rules so trying to learn a new edition now. I thought 40 shots was something good.

The 18" range will not make it easy to get those 40 shots, not many will stand around and wait for his second turn.

Assuming you got the opportunity to fire at a mob of T3 5+ standing in the open with Tfex at full health, you'd get around 8 kills. For 237 points.

Against T4 3+, you'd get 4 kills. Again, best possible (unlikely) scenario too.



I think Tfex can be an objective sitter, though I would take Acid Spray for auto-hit. 2d6 S7 ap-1 D3 Dam. Autohit overwatch. Come at me bro.

[gigasnail]

Acid spray is still only option for tfex. Maybe you can get lucky with using CP to reroll the rupture cannon, but it's real eh. The fleshborer need some kind of reroll, something. Bs4+ on something that's required to shoot is (please do not swear). They fixed the exocrine, tfex needs the rest of that buff.

[gigasnail]

Jun 6, 2017 2:13:17 GMT No One said:

gigasnail said:

Dakka flyrant, time will tell. ST and deathspitters and auto smite and catalyst is a pretty well rounded MC, and let's you bounce out of combat to shoot at the cost of just one ST cc attack.

Honestly, RC over ST for a single - 30 pts less and arguably better (reroll all wounds vs reroll 1s to hit. Less consistent Dam, but still).

Stats on m.RC? I'm not where rules are easily accessible and I don't have all this in grey matter yet.

[arapaima]

Old one eye 7th ed: flappy and sick at the price of a landraider.
Old one eye 8th ed: A force of nature, I pity anyone who faces his wrath.

Genestealer in 7th ed: "Do you remember those days when ppls are actually afraid of genestealers?"
Genestealer in 8th ed: wait they can charge and advance... oh (please do not swear).

[N.I.B.]

Most noticable, a lot of our units went from shelf ornaments to fieldable units.

[arapaima]

Yes my old one eye is not just for show. They will go from eating dust to eating ppls now.

[No One]

gigasnail said:

Stats on m.RC? I'm not where rules are easily accessible and I don't have all this in grey matter yet.

Same as scy tals (S:User, AP-3) except Dam D3 instead of a flat 3, and 6s are AP-6 and Dam3. Not really much difference - less consistent Dam about it. But it gets reroll wounds, while scy tals gets reroll 1s to hit. I'm not going to do comprehensive mucking about at the moment, but (provided I've done the maths right) it comes out ahead vs T4 3+ and T7 3+ (multi wound), all for 30 pts less. i.e. Only take scy tals if you're running double scy tals.

Also, again not comprehensive (but I can't see that changing...) - single bonesword worse than single scy tal, despite costing 4 pts more .

[xtztxtxz]

Jun 6, 2017 4:33:56 GMT gigasnail said:

Acid spray is still only option for tfex. Maybe you can get lucky with using CP to reroll the rupture cannon, but it's real eh. The fleshborer need some kind of reroll, something. Bs4+ on something that's required to shoot is (please do not swear). They fixed the exocrine, tfex needs the rest of that buff.

The trouble with the acid spray is that with variable damage its risky. If you're dropping a pod you only get 1D6 hits on the initial strike, and a poor roll means you're unlikely to land more than a wound or two. It's not like 7E where torrent could virtually guarantee X hits on landing. I'd actually argue that a rupture cannon is more reliable, as you can claim the double fire bonus from turn 1 and the payoff (2D6 damage at AP-4) is even worth a CP re-roll occasionally.

Generally, the shooting rules on both the tfex and exocrine are a little convoluted for no reason I can work out. They gave the tfex a bunch of heavy weapon options exclusive to it along with a special rule to ignore heavy weapon penalties. Why not just make them assault weapons and save a special rule for something else?
The Exocrine gets another exclusive heavy weapon, and two separate bonuses if it doesn't move. It's already effectively -1 to hit if it moves, so why not give it BS3+ natively and scrub the +1 to hit special rule?