What common enemy units must GSC kill ASAP?

[russellr]

Hi all.

I'm looking for a list of enemy units that are common and deadly to GSC. Essentially ones that we would be daft to leave alone; high priority targets. I know that depends on the army list, as we might go vehicle heavy or light, but let's not worry about that too much.

What I want is a list of common foes that are dangerous, and then it's (math)hammer time to work out what's good to kill them.

Note, I've added some that aren't necessarily common, (like the land raider), but are good comparisons anyway due to their high AV.

Imperial Knights (several variants)

Riptide

Wraithknight

Eldar Scatbikes

Necron Warriors

Space Marine Tactical Squads

Monolith

Land Raider

[N.I.B.]

Wait, why is the Landraider a high priority target for a Cult? If I'd make a list on priority targets, probably something like;

Any unit with potential Ignore Cover, either by their own or by buffing other units (Psykers, AM commanders, Hunter's Eye).
Wyverns
Thunderfire Cannons
Flamers (especially mobile flamers like Hellhounds, Heldrakes, Dreadknights)
Highly mobile high damage output units (Venoms, Scatbikes)
Wraithknights and Imperial Knights, mostly because unchecked they can wreak havoc with stomps and shooting, and especially with the IK we only have so many units that can deal with it.

Also a lot depends on the kind of game you're playing, the victory conditions should always be the deciding factor for your target priority. The balance between Eternal War, Maelstrom and secondary objectives will give you a natural priority.

[russellr]

Oct 20, 2016 7:52:16 GMT N.I.B. said:

Wait, why is the Landraider a high priority target for a Cult? If I'd make a list on priority targets, probably something like;

Any unit with potential Ignore Cover, either by their own or by buffing other units (Psykers, AM commanders, Hunter's Eye).
Wyverns
Thunderfire Cannons
Flamers (especially mobile flamers like Hellhounds, Heldrakes, Dreadknights)
Highly mobile high damage output units (Venoms, Scatbikes)
Wraithknights and Imperial Knights, mostly because unchecked they can wreak havoc with stomps and shooting, and especially with the IK we only have so many units that can deal with it.

Also a lot depends on the kind of game you're playing, the victory conditions should always be the deciding factor for your target priority. The balance between Eternal War, Maelstrom and secondary objectives will give you a natural priority.

The Land Raider could carry something dangerous, that's mostly why. Not that SM have much that would want to charge GSC units.

It's also just there due to its high AV, so the mathhammer has more comparisons.

[mattblowers]

I'm with N.I.B.: wyverns and flamers.

[No One]

If you're only looking at something to kill something else, metamorphs with claws. Winners against basically everything. Unless shooting, in which case seismic - again, winner against basically everything.

About the only exceptions are knights, which are done better by acolytes (stock in the case of WK, saws in the case of IK). And LR, but that's not exactly a huge concern (oh, your melee unit's going to hide in there, and...what. Charge my melee units ).

[mattblowers]

Oct 20, 2016 12:04:10 GMT No One said:

If you're only looking at something to kill something else, metamorphs with claws. Winners against basically everything.

The whips help too against things that hit at high initiative you get to take their numbers down before they can do any real damage to you. With the random CA rolls it's tough to get the right unit in place and ready to charge, probably better to do claws everywhere. I take hand flamers too. More pricey but it really helps the unit by reducing the number of overwatch shots you need to eat.

[No One]

mattblowers said:

The whips help too against things that hit at high initiative you get to take their numbers down before they can do any real damage to you.

While this is definitely true, if your only consideration is wanting the target dead, a unit of clawed metamorphs charging it with primus hatred bubble will kill pretty much anything. Might die doing it, but it'll be dead.

[LordPathos]

I guess Grav isn't that scary when your entire army is Sv5+

[No One]

LordPathos said:

I guess Grav isn't that scary when your entire army is Sv5+

It's no where near as good as against everything else, but that doesn't mean it's harmless. (For a comparison - grav cannon with grav amps beat out heavy bolters...that is how stupid grav is).

[tomb]

Oct 20, 2016 13:52:19 GMT No One said:

LordPathos said:

I guess Grav isn't that scary when your entire army is Sv5+

It's no where near as good as against everything else, but that doesn't mean it's harmless. (For a comparison - grav cannon with grav amps beat out heavy bolters...that is how stupid grav is).

Mechanicus / scitarri grav bots with flamers and robots with torrent flamers are troublesome.

Any torrent flamer is a pain for GSC.

[russellr]

Thanks everyone. Some of those are considerably less scary if using only MSU infantry but that's not always true.

Mitigation aside thanks for so the input so far. I was actually expecting a lot more specific units named instead of a balance between specific units and generic "guys with flamers" comments

[Hive Bahamut]

DEATHWATCH

Shunting Incinerators

Librarius Conclave/Cabal

Smart Missiles

Wyvern/TFC

Anything with rerollable ++

All flame weapons except hand flamers and maybe a poorly deployed Frag Cannon. 5+ against flamers is strange, but not AS scary.

Helldrakes

Anything with Hunters eye, Perfect timing, phase form, or other ignore cover.

Me no fear SD, unquestioning loyalty. Less so grav, Yay rags. Almost a balancer for these 2??

[kazetanade]

Until you eat S:D pieplates and templates, and Grav platforms usually have bolters in addition. There isnt really an upside to t shirts other than laughing at the poor sod who brought expensive stuff to kill trash.

In terms of deadly stuff to GSC in particular, its flamers and ignore cover large blasts, or ignore cover torrent of fire. So wherever you find those is a problem, and no need to be too specific about it.

Outside that it's the usual problems for entire meta - Knights/WK, Gladius, Grav Centstars, tough bikers, unkillable deathstars, Jaegger Command. You're not uniquely able to deal with this, but you have options to deal with it - so work with what you have. Codec GSC is nicely balanced with tools to deal with most situations in the few units they have.

[Hive Bahamut]

Nowhere does it say you can't take that auto LOS against D. In fact even Vindicaire is only -2 to LOS, which is negated by auto pass. D-Scythes aren't that scary either, as if they are in flamer range, chances are after they burn off a few members they are in charge range. Even better if they targeted some Purestrains, who will always get their ++ due to -1. Also, if you let them setup for their disembark from the Wave Serpent then you deserve to get flamed. If they used Dark Eldar, don't be mad. That army is pants.

A common misconception about Grav that I used to have as well. Only Centurions have Hurricane Bolters. Kataphron Destroyers (phosphor sucks) and bike or Marine mounted grav is going without amps, and no other weapon. Sure it still hurts, but T3 5+ is actually about as laughable as you can make it against Grav.

I still firmly believe that the Cult is meant to unhinge SD and Grav. I can't really think of an army setup that screws with either more.

[N.I.B.]

AFAIK a 6 on the D table surpasses invo saves.