Cult Stinkers?

[Hive Bahamut]

So we've had some time to mull through the book a few times and some even testing with games. What units or upgrades are looking useless? I'm spotting a few, and would like to discuss any discoveries and if they really are bad or the use is just different.

1: Aberrants ("Officer Doofy reporting for duty.") T4 multi-wounders, with no gun options, and horrid I2 with unwieldy weapons. When was the last time you used warriors? Only good for wrecking AV with Cult Ambush, which other units do better and cheaper.

2:Acolyte Iconward. OK I guess but at 65 points for a 6+ FNP bubble? Not worth it, maybe the Relic banner? This one I am unsure on.

3: Web gun variants. Like a shite reverse grav, that costs too much. The Strangleweb lives on. In text at least. Who does this affect? Eldar? Woop dee doo.

4: Dual metamorph Talons. Tossing Rending for +1 more WS? You did what?! AND you paid points?...

5: Mortars. I know the weapons teams are more fluff applicable but up until I saw it I forgot they were even a thing.

6: Heavy Rock Drill and the Snip one. Anything subbing all attacks for 1 auto-pass for me, junk. You will never hit when you need too. Snip: Anything you want to instakill is going to be S5+.

7: Goliaths: With such amazing ground rules why would you ever double the base cost for a flimsy transport that is going to barbecue all its occupants when it blows up, or they get crisped by a flamer and die inside? I imagine all mech it has its place but this army is already expensive.

8: Power picks. So you get an extra attack? I'd rather just have a power maul, at least they are +2S as well. Going unwieldy from AP4-3 is dumb.

Sentinels. Maybe handy with AV spam.. Cheap Lascannon and scouts getting d6 replenish might be hilarious, but I doubt it.

What do you think? Are there any more? Are there any on this list you disagree with and why?

[gameoverman]

Some things I turned my nose up at (thankfully not many)

The price of acolyte upgrades. With most of their options costing a miasma cannon I'm really put off upgrading them. That is offset when you consider summoning them or replenishing them. (Summoning is insane, and with cult ambush wowzers!) The cc weapons for them leave em too vulnerable, and remove their main benefit (rending at initiative 4). It could be worth it for vehichle hunting, but theyll have no problem with that anyway.

TAXES!

A very cleverly written book. Both cores either use up most of your gsc units or force you to buy a load of imperial guard. The insurrection detachment is worth it though. Not as op as some of the others, as we rely on dice rolls. Well be arriving from our own table edge with a single model replenished, as often as well be assaulting with 6 replenished.

Thankfully 3 overkill boxes seem like the magic number. Converting 10 acos to metas, and one to the iconward gives you sub uprising and brood cycle, so we didn't get the harlequin treatment too much.

That aside though. I love this book, and think it's strong, flexible and thematic.

[gigasnail]

um, webguns will maul pretty much all xenos infantry, with only a few exceptions (eldar bikes, dark reapers, fire dragons off the top of my head). they're hardly derp.

abberant in a iconward bubble is 4+ FNP, w/ biomancy magus is a 3+ FNP. cult ambush solves the problem it originally had (getting there, and getting out when it was unfavorable). i'm not saying they're (please do not swear) awesome (there are so many good units in this book), but they're hardly derp.

can't think of when you would want X2 talon on the metamorphs though, not with the way the WS chart works now. you can make a case for nearly any of the other option combos though.

we've been kicking around MSU mech in CADs for the mass obsec (because our troops are so good and cheap), but i don't think anyone's given it a serious, hard look yet, not when the formation bonuses are so good. but, that option is there. also, the rock crusher isn't open topped, just the truck.

[kazetanade]

I think you can get more reliable AP3/4 in other methods. It's also specialist in that they hit specifically T4 4+, or T3 3+, and nothing else (when will you ever see a T5 5+ or T6 6+?) Not really sold on the webbers, and they're not cheap for what they do. Models cute though.

[arapaima]

Scout sentinel but otherwise most of the options in GSC codex are great.

[kazetanade]

Oct 4, 2016 8:31:03 GMT arapaima said:

Scout sentinel but otherwise most of the options in GSC codex are great.

Dude, 45 point lascannon!!!!

[jaigo]

I ordered 2 trucks
As of yet I have no idea where to place them....
Perhaps i should have gotten more avolytes instead

[crudelord]

The Webbers smash xenos infantry to bits and have good synergy with psychic powers.

Considering your flyrants have the possibility of a d/3 debuff in powers of the Hive Mind as do your cult models you will almost invariably be able to drop a blast template on anyone in power armour, wounding on 2s or 3s and denying armour saves. (do they ignore cover or anything? Im in work atm)

They are a massive force multiplier for what is usually a relatively lame (compared to summoning/ screaming) psychic power- it's easy to get off and they would have to stop it if theres a bunch o webber dudes coming out the shadows.

[mattblowers]

Oct 4, 2016 8:31:03 GMT arapaima said:

Scout sentinel but otherwise most of the options in GSC codex are great.

They are a cheap, disposable unit that outflanks onto the table and flames troops off objectives. Might not be the best choice in this codex, but in the IG one they are invaluable.

[N.I.B.]

Iconward, don't forget Furious Charge from the Sacred Cult Banner. 24" bubble for Brood Cycle units (both this and FNP) regardless what kind of banner the Iconward is carrying. No big buffs, but there's potentially a lot of models buffed.

Aberrants, not sure. 120pts is a hefty price tag for what they bring to the table. I wish the writers had went the whole hog and made them stick out more to have a clear role in the army. Like, T5 and larger models on 40mm base, the equivalent of Cult chaos spawns, abominations that slave in the mines until the insurrection. The models are great but they should've been twice the size. This makes me suspect that the plan for Tyranids to be the BIG MONSTAHZ faction, even more than we are today.
My only game so far the only thing they did was turn up at my table edge and killed a drop pod before being instagibbed by a S8 IK pie plate, no FNP for you.

Web Pistol? A 12" blast weapon on BS3 models, and it ignores your own armour. Pass.

[mattblowers]

Oct 4, 2016 12:55:22 GMT N.I.B. said:

Web Pistol? A 12" blast weapon on BS3 models, and it ignores your own armour. Pass.

They will eat xenos for lunch though. That's what they are good at.

[N.I.B.]

Who exactly can take a Web Pistol/Webber?

[nidzy]

Oct 4, 2016 13:59:54 GMT mattblowers said:

Oct 4, 2016 12:55:22 GMT N.I.B. said:

Web Pistol? A 12" blast weapon on BS3 models, and it ignores your own armour. Pass.

They will eat xenos for lunch though. That's what they are good at.

Pretty much every model in the codex eats xenos for lunch, for cheaper.

[mattblowers]

Oct 4, 2016 15:18:14 GMT nidzy said:

Oct 4, 2016 13:59:54 GMT mattblowers said:

They will eat xenos for lunch though. That's what they are good at.

Pretty much every model in the codex eats xenos for lunch, for cheaper.

You can't think of a scenario where thining out a few Striking Scorpions, scatbikes, or fire warriors wouldn't be something you want to do before eating overwatch on T3 models?

[nidzy]

Oct 4, 2016 15:24:56 GMT mattblowers said:

Oct 4, 2016 15:18:14 GMT nidzy said:

Pretty much every model in the codex eats xenos for lunch, for cheaper.

You can't think of a scenario where thining out a few Striking Scorpions, scatbikes, or fire warriors wouldn't be something you want to do before eating overwatch on T3 models?

I don't think it is going to be all that effective for the points. You can get 2 flamers for the same price. Plus 2 more hand flamers for the cost of a second one. You will miss out on the ap 3 vs str3 models, but they will be just as effective or more against anything else because you don't have to roll to hit. It isn't overwatching fire warriors that ruin your day, it is everything backing them up with supporting fire.

It might get down to playstyle and how you build your list.

For neophytes I am going to run mining lasers anyway, keeping me out of the range of the Webber unless I am assaulting out of cult ambush. Assaulting neophytes are welcome to soak up an overwatch anyway. For Acolytes I am going to run bodies cheap and try to get more units on the table.