List from ATC

[mattblowers]

Check out this list from ATC. This is just silly.

I don't know about anyone else but facing 4 WKs just doesn't sound like any fun at all. Have you noticed how much the game has really escalated? Most of your codex is completely unplayable in this type of environment. It seems like most non-fluffy games are focused on killing that death star / gimmich unit (now units). 3 WKs was bad before, 4 with the S:D, FNP, and stomp is silly.

/rant

[WestRider]

Yeah, there are reasons for things like the ITC restrictions. Personally, I'd rather see them go even further, but at least they're shutting down that sort of nonsense.

[Kark]

Such list would annoy many people in single games, but in team play, 4 WKs can be countered, by one of Your teammates. The key here is to build armies that can counter others and captain is the one that has to pair players correctly. I don't think that allowing 4 WKs in team tournament is really a big deal.

ETC bans WKs, stompas, obelisks and IA so far.

[gigasnail]

Jul 29, 2015 13:36:54 GMT WestRider said:

Yeah, there are reasons for things like the ITC restrictions. Personally, I'd rather see them go even further, but at least they're shutting down that sort of nonsense.

yeah, like their ruling on pods!

[WestRider]

Ugh, that one was a serious WTF. I definitely have my points of disagreement with them.

But I'm just saying, if I end up running Tournaments at some point, there's not going to be any SkyHammer nonsense going on there, for instance.

[gigasnail]

Why not? It's nowhere near as bad as smash mouth IH chapter master with 2+/3++/EW/2+FNP. Or invisible dogstar. Or a ton of other things. Man I am all for clearing up half_written rules, but I'm really not a fan of just house ruling things to work how I feel they should work, because reasons (which is pretty much a direct quote of what Reece has said about why they ruled on pods and templates/markers only hitting one level of ruins). The farther it goes, the sillier it gets.

[Kark]

Skyhammer itself is not that scary, but Skyhammer + dropped centurions are nasty. All in all in team tournament it is easier to deal with all kind of nonsense, without particular restrictions.

[gigasnail]

There are plenty ty of things that are scary. My point is that house ruling stuff doesn't get rid of scary, it just moves the bar.

[mattblowers]

Jul 30, 2015 17:54:24 GMT gigasnail said:

There are plenty ty of things that are scary. My point is that house ruling stuff doesn't get rid of scary, it just moves the bar.

It is escelating rapidly. Remember when flyers felt nasty? Feels like an eternity but was only a couple of years ago. You either have to be really restrictive or not restrictive at all.

2+ FNP, how the (please do not swear) is that possible? Is it for reals or some wild rule lawyering that takes a pretzel logic to get there?

[gigasnail]

Has to do with how FNP works for IH. Needs to have an apothecary and the FNP WL trait to get the silly numbers, but it's real easy to have a 2+/3++/EW with 3+FNP, that can LoS! on a 2+ to a mook.

[WestRider]

Jul 30, 2015 17:54:24 GMT gigasnail said:

There are plenty ty of things that are scary. My point is that house ruling stuff doesn't get rid of scary, it just moves the bar.

Yes, and I prefer a game with a lower overall power level. I acknowledge that this is a personal preference and not an objective decision, but if I'm ever in a position to make these decisions, I'm going to roll that way.

[gigasnail]

And far be it from me to tell you how to have fun. It's just not an event I'd be super interested in. I didn't play in the league we just had out here for similar reasons.

[WestRider]

Not every event is for everyone. But one thing I've noticed since I've started attending Tournaments regularly again is that, at least around here, there are almost exclusively uncomped, or minimally comped, Tournaments, and very little for people who aren't up to playing at a higher level. So I figure if I ever get the chance to run an event, I'll try to put something together for the folks who get turned off by the more hardcore competitive events, get some of the garage gamers mingling with the community a bit more. And if that means that I'm not really providing a space for the hardcore gamers who already have two tournaments a month suited to them in the area, I'm ok with that.

[Freeman]

It's actually interesting how the multiple wraith knight army is going. In the atc it is all about setting team match ups so if the wks get a match where they can't be hurt their captain has done them a solid in match ups. If however they are up against a few units of grav, they are totally (please do not swear).

This translates to singles events as well. In events where multiple WKs are allowed I believe they won't be that popular when it all pans out. They will come middle of the pack as at some point they will end up facing an army with lots of grav or mobile melta and get smashed. What that usually does is mean people (especially those with aspirations of winning a tourney) won't take the list as it has its own glass ceiling.

It's like how people used to talk about DE being a king maker army as even though has too many bad match ups to win a GT it also has the capability to table a real contender and end their title push.

Unfortunately Pure DE armies have vanished as few really competitive peop,e are content being a scary mid table player.

[jaigo]

I notice a trend in more fun based tournaments.
There is a steady decline in our tournament scene and turn up overall.

But since about half a year... or now that I look for it... I notice more highlander and other formats. Restrickted in many ways and focused on playing a more elaborate mission. I do enjoy these more then armies aiming to kill in a few turns.
I therefore shift tournaments I organise more toward focus on less spam. more creative list building and involving missions.

1 such tournaments has a lot of its points to be earned revolved about list building.

1 hq 2 troops adds 3 bonus points.
0-1 hvy
0-1 fast
0-1 elite. also bonus

no duplicate units. bonus points.

I find this concept very interesting