What units are in a Null deploynent list?

[doomreaper9]

First off what is a Null deployment list? Second what units/ formations do people take?

[yoritomo]

A null deployment list is a list that doesn't set up any unit during the setup. The idea is that your opponent deploys and you are then able to bring your units on from reserve to react to how your opponent deployed.

The problem is that tyranids don't have any units that can arrive from reserve on the first turn. This means that if your token units that you start the game with die before you get your second turn you lose the game.

To answer your second question, because of the tyrannocite any unit works in a null deployment list. Really what you want to include are units you are going to spore in/deep strike anyway, like a devilfex or mawloc. Also, due to how they deploy, a lictor spam list will naturally play like a null deployment list. Which is probably why you're asking the question.

[N.I.B.]

There are no true null deployment Tyranid builds anymore, for obvious reasons.
There are lot of semi-null deployment variants you can build though. I have a build that evolves around 8 Tyrannocytes.
Lictorshame is another, and I've seen different versions.

Deploy very little and try to cripple the enemy turn 2.

[mattblowers]

Near null deployment with pure 'nids in a competitive event that doesn't have much LOS blocking terrain or ruins is gonna get you tabled on turn 1.

[FTGT-BeeCee]

One thing Nayden did was use mass amounts of spore mine units to create situations where it was difficult to get tabled due to target saturation. In his LVO list he had 6 spore mine units and 4 mucolids plus a bastion with comms.

Spore mines are pretty easy to hide and mucolids come naturally shrouded.

[doomreaper9]

How can u get table by turn two?

[doomreaper9]

I though u can only put up to half of ur army in reserves.

[doomreaper9]

Mar 3, 2015 15:31:20 GMT FTGT-BeeCee said:

One thing Nayden did was use mass amounts of spore mine units to create situations where it was difficult to get tabled due to target saturation. In his LVO list he had 6 spore mine units and 4 mucolids plus a bastion with comms.

Spore mines are pretty easy to hide and mucolids come naturally shrouded.

Beecee I thought we can only put half of our units in reserves?

[FTGT-BeeCee]

That is no longer the case. You can put whatever you want in reserve now, but if at the end of any game turn you don't have anything on the board you lose.

[doomreaper9]

Ouch

[mattblowers]

Mar 3, 2015 15:31:20 GMT FTGT-BeeCee said:

Spore mines are pretty easy to hide and mucolids come naturally shrouded.

Not on the tables I played on last weekend. Most tables consisted of 90% of terrain being forests. A 3+ isn't saving a mucolid when a single S6 wound taps it out. They pretty much had no effect on the game other than eating fire for a turn. Only 2 of my 10-11 games (I can't remember right now) rolled night fighting so I am bit jaded at the moment.

[shadowfinder]

It is true you can't do a full null deployment list with out taking a CtA allies. But a list wit the new spore field formation works very well in that you have 6 units that cost just 90 points that can all infiltrate. these units are easy to hid and 3 come with shrouded for a 2+ cover saves. Now the list you make should have at lest 1-2 more units you can deploy depending on your opponents army and ability to kill said units. the rest of the army goes in to reserve. Any deep striking or out flanking units work for this. also any unit with long range fire power.. Biovores ..

playing with poor terrain can make this list hard to play. but you should be able to as very few armies can kill 6-8 units in one turn from range. Elder can if it is a shooting gallery with no terrain but it is unlikely. you will face that every turn.

Even with decent terrain the style is very workable fun play style.

[FTGT-BeeCee]

It's going to be very tough to play null deployment without any kind of LoS blocking terrain. But honestly, if you are playing null deployment, you need to have a comms to reroll reserves. You absolutely can not rely on just pure reserve rolls, you need some kind of manipulation.

Matt,
If you are in that situation you need to try to deploy enough units that can not be tabled. Nayden would count the maximum killing potential of units his opponent had and deploy that +1 spore mine/other units. Most armies are not killing 10 units of spore mines in a single turn if you have anywhere to hide some of them. That is the beauty of spore mines. They don't give VP and they are your insurance to keep important stuff off the table when you don't go first.

That is a big part of alot of the Tyranid playstyles- mitigate the damage you are taking. None of our units are really built to charge headlong into the teeth of the enemy position. It was a guiding principle behind trapdoor spider and an integral part to the lictorshame was well.

[mattblowers]

FTGT-BeeCee,
Unfortunately I didn't take any spore mines though that is a good idea to take the maximum +1 that they can kill. Also, wyverns. You can't take enough spores to mitigate the damage. I'm also thinking ADL might be a thing to do as you could deploy that with 1 unit of rippers if they don't have any barage or units that don't need LOS and have no worries. They can't shoot what they can't see.

[shadowfinder]

Mar 3, 2015 18:19:02 GMT mattblowers said:

Mar 3, 2015 15:31:20 GMT FTGT-BeeCee said:

Spore mines are pretty easy to hide and mucolids come naturally shrouded.

Not on the tables I played on last weekend. Most tables consisted of 90% of terrain being forests. A 3+ isn't saving a mucolid when a single S6 wound taps it out. They pretty much had no effect on the game other than eating fire for a turn. Only 2 of my 10-11 games (I can't remember right now) rolled night fighting so I am bit jaded at the moment.

How many spore units did you have? You need at lest 6 to make this work. It sad the didn't have any line of sight blocking terrain. A 3+ is pretty good at surviving when compared to a 5+ or nothing. Besides wave serpents what else was throwing lots of str 6= shots around.?