Tyrant "Guard"

[misieq145]

Am I the only one angry about Tyrant Guard not getting any challenge-nullifying rules? It just doesn't make sense that, lets say, a Daemon prince, or even more dangerous Bloodthirster can just fly up to a Tyrant, challenge it and wipe it out with Guards just watching happily as their master, that they are bred to protect with their lives, is torn to shreds, waiting for their turn. This does not make any sense, even more so because Nids are voracious, ruthless aliens, not knights who get their pride hurt.
This was an issue that existed with 5th ed codex, but just because 6th ed. Now that we got an update, I find it ridiculous this has not been fixed. Another proof of thoughtlesness and lazines apparent in this codex.

[tarrasque]

I always pictured Tyranids in duels a little more along the lines of an animalistic hunter selecting an individual as it's prey, rather then a knight upholding honour.

[scrotatohead]

I know I'm not alone in considering Tyranids challenging or being challenged as absurd. Consider a Tyrant and his guard attack a lone enemy character. The character challenges the Tyrant. The Tyrant HAS to accept the challenge or stand by and watch the guard fight instead. If the Tyrant accepts the challenge the guard "cheer" him on. Both scenarios are absolutely absurd and fundamentally counter to 'Nid fluff. A creature with little or no individual self awareness, that is part of a hive mind collective, is not going to be affected by a challenge. We all know the Tyrant and Guard would fall upon that lone character as a single minded pack. In the same paragraph that says we can't have allies it should also read "Tyranid characters and independent characters can neither issue nor accept a challenge."

[jocke01]

Problem is that the whole challenge thing is written for normal armies. With the necron reboot, nids and daemons are like the only armies that don't work in a traditional manner. They don't care about ammunition and fuel, they don't need too keep morale up and for nids things like honor are meaningless.

So when these rules are written nids just have to deal with it even if it dosen't fit them. Sure they could just write a cool exception rule but that would mean that there are creative people working on the rules for this game.

I don't however see any problem when it comes to tyrant and tyrant guard with challenges. If you don't want your tyrant to fight the bloodthirster you can just deny the challenge and then the tyrant guard step forward and get smashed. Sure you can still allocate wounds on the tyrant but the option is right there.

[dumahim]

It is even written into the fluff of our codex that the Swarmlord doesn't give a (please do not swear) about challenges *note when avatar challenged him*

[herecomestomorrow]

It would make CSM players happy.

Chaos Lord: I MUST challenge you, for the glory of Chaos!
Tyrant: Not allowed.
Lord: ALL HAIL CHAOS!

[misieq145]

It's really irritating in general how nids are "SO ALIUM" they can't take allies and are punished in other ways by having limited choices, but follow these rules. I wish it actually worked both ways.

[Deleted]

Totally agree with the OP, but this is one of(possibly hundreds) those fluff and mechanics don't match up qualms. Could be easily fixed by having a rule opposite to the CSM rule where nids can't accept or issue challenges(as opposed to where CSM can't decline them).

[greyseer]

I dunno. I kinda see it like the xenomorphs from the Aliens movie.

The queen understood the idea of a challenge perfectly. When Ripley threatened her eggs, she had her warriors back off. And when Ripley burned said eggs (because one opened, which broke the unspoken deal made between them), the queen basically started hunting her.

It's an imperfect setup, but it can still be rationalized.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using proboards

[killercroc]

I really don't think tyranids should issue/accept challenges. Realistically, an alien wouldn't give a damn if you issued it a challenge, he'd eat you either way.

[coredump]

Jan 16, 2014 22:28:41 GMT killercroc said:

I really don't think tyranids should issue/accept challenges. Realistically, an alien wouldn't give a damn if you issued it a challenge, he'd eat you either way.

And we know this based on all the aliens we have had contact with....??

There is plenty of fiction that includes aliens that would understand a challenge.

[vampiremonkey]

A Tyrant on its own yes
with tyrant guard no

A Hive Tyrant would not care about a challenge , they are not knights of the swarm table.
A space marine hero challenging a lone tyrant is heroic and its something that a great hero would do. Just make it that if a tyrant refuses challenge combat is worked out normally tyrant can fight.
the tyrant can accept as well so fight a challenge as normal if he is on his own it means he has to fight. This way other armies cant use this loop hole and bypass the guard .

[gigasnail]

at the same time, there are also plenty of times when a challenge makes great sense for nids. since so many leaders lead from the front in the age of only war and powerfists, it makes sense to cut the head off the snake in the most direct fashion possible.

being locked into the mechanic is stupid though. there is no biomass in honor, so it's kind of useless to them.

[infornography]

There is a simple fix.
Make the hive guard able to accept and issue challenges.

Done.

[killercroc]

Jan 17, 2014 1:05:20 GMT coredump said:

Jan 16, 2014 22:28:41 GMT killercroc said:

I really don't think tyranids should issue/accept challenges. Realistically, an alien wouldn't give a damn if you issued it a challenge, he'd eat you either way.

And we know this based on all the aliens we have had contact with....??

There is plenty of fiction that includes aliens that would understand a challenge.

Based on all of the Tyranid fluff actually.