|
|
Post by leeroy1986 on Sept 23, 2013 7:20:39 GMT
Quite a few Ork players think they are in need of a new codex over Tyranids.
My view of this is, Tyranids need it more because we have like 3 viable units in our codex whereas Orks literally have half their book.
What is your guys view? Do you think we need a new book ahead of Orks? and why?
|
|
|
|
Post by t⊗theark on Sept 23, 2013 7:38:58 GMT
Orks have aged incredibly well from the kustom force field to nob bikers. They're limited but they're enjoying greater codex flexibility and more tournament success than the tyranids are. The tyranid codex was a piece of crud in comparison to the 4th from its release. FAQs beat it right down in 5th and 6th may have given it a bit of boost but it has the flexibility of a stunt double in a full body cast.
|
|
|
|
Post by Squire on Sept 23, 2013 8:38:24 GMT
We surely need it more. Every other army can ally in someone else to help them deal with specific problems, which isn't a solution we have. Other armies can take fortifications to help deal with flyers, we cant. Our only decent defence against flyers is a single unit, which at competitive level effectively prevents all other HQ units/builds from being viable
Not to mention the mono build issue. With both HQs flying around the battlefield and tervigons being so much better than any other source of synapse, two tervigons are needed along with the flyrants.
|
|
|
|
Post by Bot on Sept 23, 2013 10:03:29 GMT
Tyranids. While orcs took quite a hit from the 6th edition transition, don't forget that Tyranids got hit as well. We went from 17-18 viable units to 11-12... That's 2/3 of our codex which we can't use for (please do not swear). Not to mention the mono build issue. With both HQs flying around the battlefield and tervigons being so much better than any other source of synapse, two tervigons are needed along with the flyrants. I would agree with tervigons being a "Must take unit" in tournaments, but the Flyrant is not as necessary as everyone makes it. You can't go wrong with the Devil Flyrants these days, but it's not like you can't leave home without them.  |
|
|
|
Post by baconslice on Sept 23, 2013 10:16:33 GMT
Orks are older, and do need an update. But as above, I think it's the lack of allies that means Tyranids need it more.
|
|
|
|
Post by infornography on Sept 23, 2013 11:12:24 GMT
Even without allies, Tyranids need it more. Our codex is in a hell of a state. The only faction I think need it more than us is Sisters, but we know they aren't coming any time soon.
As to the necessity of flyrants, it all depends on if your local meta has a lot of flyers. If nobody takes more than one that isn't a huge gunboat then you don't need them. If your regular opponents put a good percentage of their points into the air, then you need something that can respond to them competently. And no, Dakka fexes and hive guard are not competent against flyers, they are passable in a pinch and that is pretty much it.
|
|
|
|
Post by glassiya on Sept 23, 2013 12:56:33 GMT
tyranids are very spacial army. There are too much our unique perks, like lack of vehicles, invulnerables, eternals, anti-air, allies, and so on, and so on. We're too specialized, but specialized at something that SUCKS in 6th edition - close-combat. And while Orks can fill their gaps with different units like wagons, motornobs, lootaz, allied Tau or IG... we can't.
|
|
|
|
Post by t⊗theark on Sept 23, 2013 15:20:07 GMT
tyranids are very spacial army. There are too much our unique perks, like lack of vehicles, invulnerables, eternals, anti-air, allies, and so on, and so on. We're too specialized, but specialized at something that SUCKS in 6th edition - close-combat. And while Orks can fill their gaps with different units like wagons, motornobs, lootaz, allied Tau or IG... we can't. Actually, we're not specialized in something that sucks because we're not specialized for close combat. 6th edition is seeing big blobs of cheap infantry. Cultists, conscripts, orkmobs and the such are common place in 6th weather they be primary detachment troops or allied. Tyranids can do this rather well, we just have poopoo options to really do it other than 100-150 termigants and 2-3 tervigons. It was one of our boosts in fact. |
|
|
|
Post by WestRider on Sept 23, 2013 15:20:08 GMT
I play both, and I have to say, my Orks are holding up way better than my Nids. Both actually got something of a boost from the core 6th Ed Rules, but the improvements for Orks were more widely spread across the Army, while those for Nids basically helped our Psykers.
I haven't been playing either much for a while, but with the Orks it's because I'm bored, while with the Nids, I'm frustrated.
|
|
|
|
Post by deathscream on Sept 23, 2013 15:57:01 GMT
I feel like I might be slightly biased here, but Tyranids. I've seen some creative lists around lately, but more often than naught, its the twin Flyrant and Tervi lists. Where as I see all kinds of competitive Ork lists kicking the (please do not swear) out of my armies... Plus, I hate Orks. It's the Crimson Fists player in me, I guess. End of Line |
|
|
|
Post by glassiya on Sept 23, 2013 17:22:03 GMT
nope.
6th edition is about hurricane infantry shooting (like DA salvoes for example), which devastate "big blobs of cheap infantry".
6th is about Heldrakes, Shadowstar, Broadsides, Eldar fields and so on. Basically, about something that is well-armored and has good shooting with Ignore Cover. Everything else is pretty much experience points for them.
no. We have "cheap" hormies and rippers. When did you played with them last time? and when did you took termagants in 100-150 numbers?
Don't say anything about tervigon. It's not help. It's the most broken model in our whole codex. The fact it's damn overpowerd and underpriced is a con, not a pro.
|
|
|
|
Post by leeroy1986 on Sept 23, 2013 19:34:54 GMT
Orks seems to think their only viable options are Dakkajets, Lootas and shootas and I quote "When Orks have to rely on their shooting you know you're in trouble". Which I personally think is nonsense imo Ork shooting is pretty damned good arguabily better than ours.
|
|
|
|
Post by WestRider on Sept 23, 2013 20:01:34 GMT
Orks basically have Lootaz and Shootaz, Armoured Krumpany, and Wazdakka Biker Spam as their main options at the moment, with a certain amount of possible variation around those three cores.
Also, despite the two edition changes that have increased power levels since then, Lootaz and Shootaz are not just "adequate", but are excellent Units. Point for Point, Lootaz generate more S7 Hits on average than IG Autocannon Heavy Weapons Squads, and on the same basis, Shoota Boyz can outshoot almost any other Troops Choice in the Game. Nids don't have anything on that level.
|
|
|
|
Post by tanagra on Sept 23, 2013 20:42:15 GMT
Orks and Nids are doing well with their old codexes, but the orks still have variety in their list building. For nids to be competitive, we are stuck using the same core HQ and troops with the only variations being our elites, heavys and fast attacks.
I'd end up in an argument if I ever met an ork player who says otherwise. The ones I know in my local area all love their orks this edition.
|
|
|
|
Post by Davor on Sept 23, 2013 21:33:42 GMT
Does it really matter who needs it more? GW will release what ever they want when they want. Look at Dark Eldar. They needed a release over 5 years ago. It took them 10 years to get a release. Same thing happened to Necrons as well. So just because a codex needs a release more, doesn't mean it will get one. Other wise Sisters of Battle would have had a release by now. Another thing, for people who love/is main codex for them, they will always say they need their codex first because they want new shiny toys/rules.  |
|
