Getting back into Tyranids, a few questions.

[killercroc]

Hello all, it's been a while since I've played 40k and have been looking at getting back into the swing of things. A buddy of mine is hosting a tournament event on May 4th-5th at 2000 points and has sent out notice to pretty much every game store in the area, so far 30 people have agreed to it but he's hoping to get up to 100! So it should be a nice little thing here if we can get it all going. That being said, I haven't played since 9th ed, and even at that I played 3 games before I was just fed up with it all. I'm trying to have a more positive outlook on the game, and it does seem like people are enjoying 10th ed a bit. We usually have 2-3 games going at the LGS and the one down the way just held an escalation campaign with 14 or so people and when I would stop by they seemed to be enjoying themselves. (of course there where the obligatory cheesy player or two when everyone else was running a bunch of new combat patrols or split Leviathan boxes but I guess that'll always happen). Unfortunately I missed out on the launch of 10th ed, I was out of state in the hospital for a major operations for a month then had to stay near the hospital for the next 3 months for follow up tests and all that annoying stuff. I did get my hands on a Leviathan box so did get the new Nids and the rulebook. Have managed to read through the rules a few times, they seem simple enough to go along with and do have the latest datacards just have yet to get the codex itself!

That all being said, I have kept an eye on things, battle reports, meta-watch, forum posts etc. so I think I have a decent enough idea on the game and Tyranids even though I've yet to play. There were a few things I did have questions on, that I guess are more clarifications than anything else.

For gaunts it really comes down to what seems to be the best wargear? I see a lot of posts looking at Spinefists being the best but it may be something I'm not seeing. Mathing them out Spineguants and Devilgaunts are equivalent at doing damage to Meq and Geq, Spinefists Twin-linked does give them better chance to off-set bad rolls, but Devourers do have better range so have a bit more chance to whittle things down from range and sit on an objective and still add their firepower in the middle of the board. Additionally, is it best running squads of 10 or 20? I know for things like stratagems it's better to target large units, but splitting them into two squads does give better board control, blocking off the enemy, scoring two objectives, etc. Or does it really just come down to personal choice?

Warriors, looking at Melee warriors and Ranged warriors, it seems ranged are much better. Sure they lose one attack and an AP, but the added attacks from ranged weapons seems way better to me. Most my warriors are Deathspitter/Barbed stranglers since they've always been the best cheap Synapse fire support... However looking at Devourers for them, 5 shots with the buff from the prime seems like some pretty decent mid-range consistent damage for taking out infantry units. I don't see warriors taken very often in peoples lists, is there a reason for this? They've always been a main staple in my lists.

A lot of the big bugs seem pretty obvious which are good, which are bad.. Exocrine and Tyrannofex seem really good Maleceptor is a bit expensive for short range but can really wreck things in a good position, big question is the Haruspex. Thing gets quite a few number of attacks and can force battle shock checks just after a combat which is nice, but I've seen people saying he's not that worth it. Is the Haruspex really that bad, or is it more so the Exocrine is cheaper and can put out similar damage from range just making it the better choice? Are there any big bugs that are better or worse than they first appear to be?

Lastly just in general, are they pretty good unit/leader/stratagem that should be brought in every list?

[piersonsmuppet]

Gants should use Spinefists. This choice isn't for damage but for the keywords on the weapon. Assault lets them Advance and shoot, which in turns allows them to Advance and action. They also have Pistol, which lets them perform actions while engaged. If your Gants can't action, you can't score. Generally, you want to run 20 so that they can be hit with either Invasion Fleet's 5++ and D3+3 regen, or Unending Swarm's -1 to-hit and full unit regen. If using Gants outside of those detachments, I'd prob just run 10-man units.

Warriors are fairly weak this edition but can do well in Synaptic Nexus or Vanguard detachments. In either case, melee warriors are better because of Twin-link and Neurolictor's (or Vanguard's Surprise Assault) ability to give +1 to-wound. When taken in Vanguard detchments, they also need a Tyranid Prime attached to the unit to gain the needed keyword.

Exocrine and Malceptor are prob the best units in the army atm, they work well in any detachment. Tfex and Haruspex are okay, not terrible takes but they won't really do a ton either. Acidspray is the best option for Tfex, overwatch is very good this edition and it combos well with Neurolictor +1 to-wound.

In general, 1 biovore is a great take for secondaries; Neurolictors are great synergy pieces; Lictors are good throwaway scoring units or character snipers (Deathleaper is a great character too); and gargoyles are the best troop in the game. The way the edition works with detachments determining the enhancements or stratagems you can use, there isn't really a blanket recommendation until you've decided which one you want to run. Here are a few:

Invasion Fleet--Tyrant (or Flyrant) w/ adaptive biology, OOE w/ 2x 4DS Carnifex, the 5++ and d3+3 regen are heavily used, Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles.

Vanguard--Neurotyrant w/ hunting grounds; Flyrant w/ chameleonic (im not a huge fan); all the strats are good; melee warriors (w/ tyranid prime), genestealers w/ BL, Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles.

Synaptic Nexus--Neurotyrant w/ power of the hive mind; Tyrant (or Flyrant) w/ -1D; OOE alone; all strats are good; Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles, Zoans and Warriors are decent.

Unending Swarm--Tervigon; Gants w/ spine fists, Horms, and Gargs in 20x blocks; the resurrect strat is king, 6" auto advance is great, and -1 to-hit are good; Exo & Mal spam to fill out pts.


Vanguard and Unending Swarm both like to play fixed secondaries over tactical, I find SL to be a pretty good take for the CP regen since the best strats in both cost 2CP.

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Sorry about your hospital stay! Hope you're doing much better and are on the mend.

For gaunts, they can't really kill much this edition. They either do not have the range, shot count, strength, or AP. As they cannot kill things, people are running them in the best way to score points: spine fists. GW did away with true actions going into 10. Instead they have a stupid "you can score this if you could shoot" mechanic. As spine fists have both assault and pistol, you can do an action while in combat or after advancing which can really give you the flexibility to score more.

For warriors, I think that the melee warriors are largely run as a counter charge threat. The extra AP is decent (AP-2 is really nids best minus one or two other weapons). Run them with a prime (and maybe enhancements?), for maximum benefits. Ranged warriors are ok into base marines but not much else. They don't have great strength, AP, or damage and really should have BS3. The other problem with warriors is that they're at a terrible spot stat wise as both small arms and heavy weapons can destroy them easily. Competitively, they're either a counter charge or a buffing unit but cannot do much damage on their oen.

I think exocrines are run instead of haruspex to get rerolls to wounds.

For warlords and characters, I'd say whatever fits the list.

Another thing that I'm realizing is that this edition more than others, nids are more towards scoring and less towards killing your opponent. We have a lot of tools for scoring (biovores, battle shock, etc) but have issues removing threats.

For building your list, I'd recommend looking at what detachment you want to run and theming around that. I've found that the detachments + theming leads to decent lists that are fun to play or will lead to close games.

[killercroc]

Feb 13, 2024 23:16:28 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

Gants should use Spinefists. This choice isn't for damage but for the keywords on the weapon. Assault lets them Advance and shoot, which in turns allows them to Advance and action. They also have Pistol, which lets them perform actions while engaged. If your Gants can't action, you can't score. Generally, you want to run 20 so that they can be hit with either Invasion Fleet's 5++ and D3+3 regen, or Unending Swarm's -1 to-hit and full unit regen. If using Gants outside of those detachments, I'd prob just run 10-man units.

Warriors are fairly weak this edition but can do well in Synaptic Nexus or Vanguard detachments. In either case, melee warriors are better because of Twin-link and Neurolictor's (or Vanguard's Surprise Assault) ability to give +1 to-wound. When taken in Vanguard detchments, they also need a Tyranid Prime attached to the unit to gain the needed keyword.

Exocrine and Malceptor are prob the best units in the army atm, they work well in any detachment. Tfex and Haruspex are okay, not terrible takes but they won't really do a ton either. Acidspray is the best option for Tfex, overwatch is very good this edition and it combos well with Neurolictor +1 to-wound.

In general, 1 biovore is a great take for secondaries; Neurolictors are great synergy pieces; Lictors are good throwaway scoring units or character snipers (Deathleaper is a great character too); and gargoyles are the best troop in the game. The way the edition works with detachments determining the enhancements or stratagems you can use, there isn't really a blanket recommendation until you've decided which one you want to run. Here are a few:

Invasion Fleet--Tyrant (or Flyrant) w/ adaptive biology, OOE w/ 2x 4DS Carnifex, the 5++ and d3+3 regen are heavily used, Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles.

Vanguard--Neurotyrant w/ hunting grounds; Flyrant w/ chameleonic (im not a huge fan); all the strats are good; melee warriors (w/ tyranid prime), genestealers w/ BL, Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles.

Synaptic Nexus--Neurotyrant w/ power of the hive mind; Tyrant (or Flyrant) w/ -1D; OOE alone; all strats are good; Exo & Mal spam backed by gargoyles, Zoans and Warriors are decent.

Unending Swarm--Tervigon; Gants w/ spine fists, Horms, and Gargs in 20x blocks; the resurrect strat is king, 6" auto advance is great, and -1 to-hit are good; Exo & Mal spam to fill out pts.


Vanguard and Unending Swarm both like to play fixed secondaries over tactical, I find SL to be a pretty good take for the CP regen since the best strats in both cost 2CP.

Ok, I see the use of Spinefists now, did not realize they changed how actions work, does make it a bit more handy for them to advance and still claim an objective or use an action!

Also a bummer to hear Warriors aren't in the best spot! Some of my favorite Tyranid units to field! Have so many of them would be nice if they were able to do something this edition. So sounds like with Neurolictors or in Vanguard they can be more useful, and more so with the Prime buff. Sort of wish there was a non-winged prime cause it sort of feels like a waste to have the wings and be tied up in a squad without them.

Well I have one Exocrine and one Maleceptor but may have to get more, if they're our best units and from what I can tell 10th is a "spam the best thing" kind of game, might need to get more Bio-artillery going for a tournament game! Would like to get at least one Haruspex for smaller or more casual games to see if he can throw out the damage he appears to be capable of causing.

I'll look more into including the other units. I have 3 lictors right now, plan on getting a Neurolictor. I only have 20 Gargoyles cause I never much liked them, but with objectives, deep strike and their ability to shoot and move may very much be worth it to take.

Thanks for the breakdown of the types of detachments, I was looking at either Vanguard or Unending swarm as those are how I sort of run my army anyway. Having unkillable blobs of gaunts sounds fun!

Feb 13, 2024 23:44:55 GMT hivefleetkerrigan said:

Sorry about your hospital stay! Hope you're doing much better and are on the mend.

For gaunts, they can't really kill much this edition. They either do not have the range, shot count, strength, or AP. As they cannot kill things, people are running them in the best way to score points: spine fists. GW did away with true actions going into 10. Instead they have a stupid "you can score this if you could shoot" mechanic. As spine fists have both assault and pistol, you can do an action while in combat or after advancing which can really give you the flexibility to score more.

For warriors, I think that the melee warriors are largely run as a counter charge threat. The extra AP is decent (AP-2 is really nids best minus one or two other weapons). Run them with a prime (and maybe enhancements?), for maximum benefits. Ranged warriors are ok into base marines but not much else. They don't have great strength, AP, or damage and really should have BS3. The other problem with warriors is that they're at a terrible spot stat wise as both small arms and heavy weapons can destroy them easily. Competitively, they're either a counter charge or a buffing unit but cannot do much damage on their oen.

I think exocrines are run instead of haruspex to get rerolls to wounds.

For warlords and characters, I'd say whatever fits the list.

Another thing that I'm realizing is that this edition more than others, nids are more towards scoring and less towards killing your opponent. We have a lot of tools for scoring (biovores, battle shock, etc) but have issues removing threats.

For building your list, I'd recommend looking at what detachment you want to run and theming around that. I've found that the detachments + theming leads to decent lists that are fun to play or will lead to close games.

Thank you, I am doing much better now! I'll never truly recover but it is a lot better than before.

Sad to hear they cannot really kill things, but I guess they've never really been good at that. I figured with 20 Devilgaunts they should be able to take some things down, gettings buffs and whatnot, however it may be best to leave them for scoring instead.

Was thinking it was weird that ranged Warriors, and most our stuff lacks BS 3+ even for more dedicated shooting units. Don't have much BS, Range, A, AP or Dmg to do much... yep feels like the typical GW treatment of Tyranids... I am home! Sucks to hear they're taken out so easily by light or heavy weapons, does put them in a fairly troubled spot, for their points you figure they'd be more useful.

Honestly, it's kind of disheartening to hear that our focus is on scoring objectives not on killing things, yeah sure it goes for winning the game but it seems counterintuitive towards Tyranids being a ravaging alien horde that just... touches an objective and claims victory heh. But will see how things go after I get a few games in! Already have one set for this Saturday so hope it goes well, just a small 500 point game to hopefully not take too long as I have other things to get done.

[mattblowers]

Feb 13, 2024 15:59:23 GMT killercroc said:

Hello all, it's been a while since I've played 40k and have been looking at getting back into the swing of things. A buddy of mine is hosting a tournament event on May 4th-5th at 2000 points and has sent out notice to pretty much every game store in the area, so far 30 people have agreed to it but he's hoping to get up to 100! So it should be a nice little thing here if we can get it all going. That being said, I haven't played since 9th ed, and even at that I played 3 games before I was just fed up with it all. I'm trying to have a more positive outlook on the game, and it does seem like people are enjoying 10th ed a bit. We usually have 2-3 games going at the LGS and the one down the way just held an escalation campaign with 14 or so people and when I would stop by they seemed to be enjoying themselves. (of course there where the obligatory cheesy player or two when everyone else was running a bunch of new combat patrols or split Leviathan boxes but I guess that'll always happen). Unfortunately I missed out on the launch of 10th ed, I was out of state in the hospital for a major operations for a month then had to stay near the hospital for the next 3 months for follow up tests and all that annoying stuff. I did get my hands on a Leviathan box so did get the new Nids and the rulebook. Have managed to read through the rules a few times, they seem simple enough to go along with and do have the latest datacards just have yet to get the codex itself!

That all being said, I have kept an eye on things, battle reports, meta-watch, forum posts etc. so I think I have a decent enough idea on the game and Tyranids even though I've yet to play. There were a few things I did have questions on, that I guess are more clarifications than anything else.

For gaunts it really comes down to what seems to be the best wargear? I see a lot of posts looking at Spinefists being the best but it may be something I'm not seeing. Mathing them out Spineguants and Devilgaunts are equivalent at doing damage to Meq and Geq, Spinefists Twin-linked does give them better chance to off-set bad rolls, but Devourers do have better range so have a bit more chance to whittle things down from range and sit on an objective and still add their firepower in the middle of the board. Additionally, is it best running squads of 10 or 20? I know for things like stratagems it's better to target large units, but splitting them into two squads does give better board control, blocking off the enemy, scoring two objectives, etc. Or does it really just come down to personal choice?

Warriors, looking at Melee warriors and Ranged warriors, it seems ranged are much better. Sure they lose one attack and an AP, but the added attacks from ranged weapons seems way better to me. Most my warriors are Deathspitter/Barbed stranglers since they've always been the best cheap Synapse fire support... However looking at Devourers for them, 5 shots with the buff from the prime seems like some pretty decent mid-range consistent damage for taking out infantry units. I don't see warriors taken very often in peoples lists, is there a reason for this? They've always been a main staple in my lists.

A lot of the big bugs seem pretty obvious which are good, which are bad.. Exocrine and Tyrannofex seem really good Maleceptor is a bit expensive for short range but can really wreck things in a good position, big question is the Haruspex. Thing gets quite a few number of attacks and can force battle shock checks just after a combat which is nice, but I've seen people saying he's not that worth it. Is the Haruspex really that bad, or is it more so the Exocrine is cheaper and can put out similar damage from range just making it the better choice? Are there any big bugs that are better or worse than they first appear to be?

Lastly just in general, are they pretty good unit/leader/stratagem that should be brought in every list?

Welcome back killercroc it's good to see an old hiver return.

A couple observations from my experience in this edition: gaunts: run 10. Don't worry about the gun. They might pick up a wound or two, but their whole purpose is take up space and score (some things never change). Gargoyles are our best gribblies, it isn't even close. I don't know about the new points change, but I still think a unit of 10 is mandatory.

Warriors: for me they are just bad. Hard pass. They do nothing well. They don't put out a lot of damage, they don't score really well, they aren't survivable, and they aren't fast. I have no idea what to do with them.

Big bugs: if you like big bugs this is the edition for you. Most of our big bugs can worked into a list and be decent. Currently I'm running two Norn Emissaries in every list. They take up so much attention while I go win the game. I'm really enjoying them. The haruspex is in a weird place: it's so cheap it has to be good, right? Except they never contribute for me. They are a distraction but without an invul they fold quickly. I really like Maleceptor (because of the invul) and they can pose some real challenges. The exocrine is our consistently best shooter. The t-fex is way too swingy for me. When I need big damage, he whiffs and smacks like a girl; when I just need to take the last few wounds off he rolls hot enough to have killed it at full health by himself. Happens all the time. I'm over it. He's the Dan Marino of our codex: fabulous stat line that makes you drool - but consistently chokes when it's go time.

[killercroc]

Feb 14, 2024 17:15:32 GMT mattblowers said:

Welcome back killercroc it's good to see an old hiver return.

A couple observations from my experience in this edition: gaunts: run 10. Don't worry about the gun. They might pick up a wound or two, but their whole purpose is take up space and score (some things never change). Gargoyles are our best gribblies, it isn't even close. I don't know about the new points change, but I still think a unit of 10 is mandatory.

Warriors: for me they are just bad. Hard pass. They do nothing well. They don't put out a lot of damage, they don't score really well, they aren't survivable, and they aren't fast. I have no idea what to do with them.

Big bugs: if you like big bugs this is the edition for you. Most of our big bugs can worked into a list and be decent. Currently I'm running two Norn Emissaries in every list. They take up so much attention while I go win the game. I'm really enjoying them. The haruspex is in a weird place: it's so cheap it has to be good, right? Except they never contribute for me. They are a distraction but without an invul they fold quickly. I really like Maleceptor (because of the invul) and they can pose some real challenges. The exocrine is our consistently best shooter. The t-fex is way too swingy for me. When I need big damage, he whiffs and smacks like a girl; when I just need to take the last few wounds off he rolls hot enough to have killed it at full health by himself. Happens all the time. I'm over it. He's the Dan Marino of our codex: fabulous stat line that makes you drool - but consistently chokes when it's go time.

Thanks it's nice to be back!

Gaunts for scoring, fair enough. At their points cost I'd say they're not too bad at that, a few units of gaunts can easily plug up some space on the board and hold quarters without being a huge investment. Any work on Hormagaunts? With their speed and advance and charge I figure they'd be fairly good at tying some units up and causing some havoc. Gargoyles for getting some scoring over anything else it seems.

Again, bummer about Warriors being so meh, clearly I investing too much in the wrong unit! Well, I still play the old school 2nd and 4th edition from time to time so at least they're useful for that.

I haven't gotten the new Norn Emissary, it looks amazing and I want one, just couldn't justify getting one since I wasn't playing, I can see how they draw a lot of attention. Big killy bugs with potential OC15 means they can snatch any objective they want, makes your opponent address them! And you're right, for the points cost and number of attacks the Haruspex should be good! No Invuln like the Maleceptor does hurt them quite a bit, can get lucky and deploy them on a side with less AT guns and hope they make it... but they need a good situation to really be a useful unit so, not particularly reliable. Tyrannofex does seem like the best shooter but I can see how he is a bit too swingy for reliable damage when needed, I've always had that problem with mine as well, either always missed or just did minimum damage, another Exocrine and something else for the points would have been better. Sure Exo has les Str but with more shots out it balances out in the end. Bio-artillery is always fun!

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Note on gaunts: I'd advocate for units of 20 in invasion fleet. It's more bang for your buck when you go to res a unit.

Hormogaunts are ok. Good for charging long distances, flipping objectives, and tying up opponents units. But they won't kill too many marines in my experience.

[Jbizzy]

Hey croc, welcome back!

Best use of melee warriors ive seen is hide them until late game and counter attack. They are two slow to engage fast and will get in the way.

Shooting warriors were severely screwed with the loss of assault on guns and they no longer have okay melee.

[killercroc]

Feb 18, 2024 23:13:34 GMT Jbizzy said:

Hey croc, welcome back!

Best use of melee warriors ive seen is hide them until late game and counter attack. They are two slow to engage fast and will get in the way.

Shooting warriors were severely screwed with the loss of assault on guns and they no longer have okay melee.

Thanks, nice to be back!

Yeah I did encounter that in a game I had this weekend, just a small little 500 point game to get into it. I brought 2 units of warriors, the same unit I use to always bring, Scything talons and 2 with deathspitters and 2 with barbed stranglers. Now a lot of it was due to bad rolling but they just couldn't do a lot of damage. Was fighting Guard, they did well against infantry squad, shooting and charging and wiped them out. Against a rough rider squad though their weapons just weren't as effective and the rough riders killed them in a single charge due to melta lances.

Deathspitters getting 3 S5 shots meant hitting on 4's, wounding on 3's so... average 1 wound a turn, and with AP -1 basically that just gets rid of the cover bonus so 67% for killing one guard. For a 70 point unit I expect them to do more than about 3 wounds on average with their guns. I mainly use them for rear line synapse units and fire support, but now their support just isn't that good. Was possibly thinking about giving them Devourers, so 5 shots 5 melee attacks just to put out as much dice as possible, but then if I wan't that I could just run Devilgaunts instead for less points and more bodies. I thought being T5 with a 4+ and 3 wounds would give the Warriors staying power but no, they disappeared very quickly.

Up side, I did win the game 43:5 even though I almost got tabled because my opponent didn't play the objective at all so... that's a consolation! ha.

[Jbizzy]

Warriors are T5?!? When did that happen lol! All the editions meld into one mass with enough time between games...

Warrior shooting needed more flavour on devourers and deathspitters with the loss of assault. Maybe devs with anti infantry 4+ and deathspitters AP -2 would have given them some purpose... Spinefists warriors might be okay as back field synapse and actions? Or take spinegaunts for cheaper and no synapse...

[killercroc]

Feb 20, 2024 20:00:25 GMT Jbizzy said:

Warriors are T5?!? When did that happen lol! All the editions meld into one mass with enough time between games...

Warrior shooting needed more flavour on devourers and deathspitters with the loss of assault. Maybe devs with anti infantry 4+ and deathspitters AP -2 would have given them some purpose... Spinefists warriors might be okay as back field synapse and actions? Or take spinegaunts for cheaper and no synapse...

I mean, most of the big 40-50mm base models are T5-6 now, flip side every army has so many S6+ weapons being T5 doesn't actually matter at all.

Big way to fix Deathspitters I'd say is go back to making them blast weapons like in the good ol' days. Small blast, D3 shots but since most units have 10 models in them opening salvo will be D3+2 so 3-5 shots a gun would help a lot. Oh, and making them BS 3+, why are our shooty bugs still BS 4+!! As it stands, hitting on 4's with 3 S5 AP-1 Dmg1 weapons just doesn't do darn near anything to make them good at the role, they should be cheaper or get better guns.

[purestrain]

Tyranid weapon sets should have static abilities built in, and no other variance.

All Warrior and carnifex weapons should be BS 3+

Devourers on small frames should be a5 s3 sustained hits 1.

On heavy troops (ie warriors) they should be a5 s4 ap-1 sustained hits 1

On monsters they should be a6 s6 ap-2 1d sustained hits 2 anti infantry 3+

Deathspitters on heavy troops should be a4 s5 ap-2 d1 lethal hits.

On monsters they should be a4 s7 ap-3 2d devastating wounds and anti Monster/Vehicle 4+.

Double sets of devs should give reroll hits and Dual sets of spitters should give reroll wounds.

[killercroc]

Agreed there, it's not that we have bad guns, it's more so we don't have competitive guns on the units that get them. Exocrine has a great gun, been taking 2 every game! Thing is, in smaller games or when you don't want to bring them you run into a problem or if you want to go with an easier list. It seems our guns are either very good, or not very good. It would be nice to see a bit of variation on our heavier bugs, for their cost Warriors should be able to back a good assortment of anti-Infantry/Elite/Tank weapons but they really don't get a huge spread, they're all just anti-infantry. Also yeah make things BS 3+, Carnifex is so points heavy but BS/WS 4+? Why. Quad Deathspitters does look fairly nice for the Fex, but that 4+ to hit is a huge drawback.

[sporesprayer]

Warriors have had a tough time for a while. I still remember the edition where 'if the weapon strength is double the model's toughness wounds auto kill' because of the pulp my warriors became.

One thing I am interested in is that termagant's strangleweb is 18" assault, devastating wounds, torrent and you can get 2 in the squad. If you are running minimum unit size termagant squads they still have their action and chances to deal wounds that can't be saved.

[creatureboi]

What makes spinefists on gaunts so good is the pistol keyword. That means they still get to shoot in combat but more importantly they are still “eligible to shoot” while in combat and can therefore do “actions” for secondary objectives. None of the gaunts weapons are especially good at killing things and that’s not really what you take them for. They’re there to gum up the enemy, move block, grab objectives and screen.

Warriors haven’t been good for a while. Although the weapon options are better on them they’re just not survivable and it’s a lot of points invested in a unit that will die as soon as anything looks at it funny. I quite like them in a vanguard assault detachment led by a winged prime so they get advance and charge then run them across the board as a suicide unit to distract from your lictors who are sitting on objectives and scoring primary and secondary VPs but that’s a bit of a niche use for them and overall you’re probably better off leaving them at home.

Big bugs are pretty good, with a few overpriced exceptions. Again, they’re not as tough as they look so you will want to either take none at all thus meaning any anti-tank weapons your opponent has are wasted shooting out one termagant a round, or take ALL the monsters on the “more bodies than bullets” principle.

For someone just starting out or getting back into the hobby after a long time away I’d recommend using the invasion swarm detachment which is probably the most well-rounded, and just playing a few games with models you like the look of. Keep a solid core of your army the same from game to game and only swap out the odd unit here and there while you get used to the rules. Don’t worry too much about what the internet says are the “best” choices because you will probably lose anyway and a lot of the meta builds rely on a specific trick or skill to run properly.