January data slate rumour

[N.I.B.]

Mid Jan release:

Tyranids
Overrun is Core only.
Spore Mines cost Reinforcement points.
Most competitive units gets a 10-40% point increase.

[princeyg]

Don't mind the overrun change, but the rumor is that raveners are going up 15pts!!! thats...thats just excessive.

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Source?

If that's true, I think the metawatch discussion in February will be "well we went over board on Tyranids, but space marines need more buffs"

[LordPathos]

Leaks from Auspex. If true...well we had fun for the end of 9th edition.

[dkng]

Buckle your seatbelt Dorothy 'cause Kansas is going bye bye

[nameless]

Damn, heavy changes but everyone losing AoC helps us a ton too. Let’s not kid ourselves, this stuff deserved it (assuming warriors get war gear adjustments). We have people wanting to take 6 units of ravs in a thread from a few days ago, for example, so let’s not be too surprised by the increases (the last game I played have every one of these units but 2). Harpy being forced to start in reserve probably doesn’t need a hike though.

All that said, I’m looking forward to trying out new units and combos with these hikes though. The best part of this game is that things change so often so things are always fresh.

[alx51]

And I will happily take all those nerfs if we have a necron/sister level of secondaries. We have other good units in the codex, aoc gone would be a huge buff for us, and a meta with less troops means less screening...

[dkng]

We won't get any better secondaries I'm afraid. Tyranids just have to be stomped to the ground.
Events stats from december are showing Tyranids sitting at 50,8% from 392 games. There is no way we will keep this level if those rumors turn out to be true.
AM and LoV are going to rolfstomp everything for next 3-6 months until GW fulfill their sales targets. Then they'll nerf those two without (re-)buffing Nids.
10th edition is our only hope now... and as we seem to be the main antagonist faction to most probably be released as the first/second army in new edition, powercreep will eat us up pretty quickly.
*Sigh*

[trashcan01]

Gw tried to be gentle on two occasions and failed to reign in the Tyranids.

While I need to see how the point changes translate on my lists the increase feels heavy handed, but I'll wait for the official release before I unleash the rage.
Tyranids are no longer A tier faction, if the rumors are true.

I only feel sorry for the Genestealers, too bad they didn't get buffed a bit. 10ed is around the corner and I'm fine with losing a few games.

[piersonsmuppet]

Horms/Terms are looking pretty good post Jan, they benefit greatly from the loss of AoC and are pretty efficient into what the rumor mill predicts to be the top factions.

TI lists still have Haruspex, Toxicrene, and Mawloc as pts efficient bodies to run amok (again all got a boost from the AoC axe).

Personally I’m looking at Behemoth, Gorgon, and Hydra for Horms. Levi Tervigon, Behemoth Haruspex, and Kronos Toxicrene will have some play I think. STC harpies will definitely still be around.

Point is, we have plenty of options that have been good (but not great). We will probably be fine going forward, just can’t slam warriors/ravs/zoans onto the board and win.

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Kraken is still pretty solid, imo. Going fast never hurts and additional AP is even better without AoC

[purestrain]

So what you're saying is A tyranid prime, 3 mucolid spores and a Hierophant for 1k points on the dot? and is legal in AoO?

Excellent

[dkng]

Dec 28, 2022 14:45:05 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

Horms/Terms are looking pretty good post Jan, they benefit greatly from the loss of AoC and are pretty efficient into what the rumor mill predicts to be the top factions.

TI lists still have Haruspex, Toxicrene, and Mawloc as pts efficient bodies to run amok (again all got a boost from the AoC axe).

Personally I’m looking at Behemoth, Gorgon, and Hydra for Horms. Levi Tervigon, Behemoth Haruspex, and Kronos Toxicrene will have some play I think. STC harpies will definitely still be around.

Point is, we have plenty of options that have been good (but not great). We will probably be fine going forward, just can’t slam warriors/ravs/zoans onto the board and win.

I'm not that optimistic. All those units are mediocre at best and are kind of designed to do what other units do better / cheaper.
The rumoured changes will strip us hard from antitank and antielite firepower. Rupturefexes, Acidfexes, Carnifexes with HVCs, Harpies with HVCs, MWs from Zoans, Boneswords... Those are the things that make us scary and taking away some of them sounds reasonable but taking all of them away seems... over the top.
And please do not even suggest AoC going away is any kind of saving grace for us. There are armies not even scratched by the proposed changes - look at AM for example. How do you see the prospect of going against their tanks after the patch? Have you seen the points drops of Deamons? Without as many Zoans and without mines, how are we gonna deal with them? Horms and Haruspexes will not deliver - we both know it.
Other strong armies are also getting knee-capped I know. SoBs and Harlies are going down with us but this is not something making me feel better. We will fall from our current 51% waaay down and will shelf our Tyranid minis waiting for 10th.

[piersonsmuppet]

Dec 28, 2022 15:41:56 GMT hivefleetkerrigan said:

Kraken is still pretty solid, imo. Going fast never hurts and additional AP is even better without AoC

The AP prob won't mean much; Chaos doesn't care and there is going to be a lot of 2+/4++, 3+/5++, and 4+/6++ running around. Most things that are good in Kraken already have AP-2, so the fleet trait loses efficiency with AoC going away. Horms are the main thing that wants AP-2 but are deadlier in other hive fleets and don't need the mobility. Couple that with everything that was good in Kraken seeing significant pts hikes, I don't think Kraken will be as dominant as it was. The fleet will still be good, but will probably require very tight play and have a few bad matchups.

Dec 28, 2022 17:25:03 GMT purestrain said:

So what you're saying is A tyranid prime, 3 mucolid spores and a Hierophant for 1k points on the dot? and is legal in AoO?

Excellent

The Hierophant should get fleet traits in the AoO detachment as well. I think it could be funny in a TI & Heightened Reflexes custom fleet, or Kronos.

[nameless]

You might be right and the sky has finally fell (like everyone has said after each changes; it’s the end of tyranids…), but all those things you mentioned are hyper efficient. HVC have been one of the best guns in the game (especially in Lev) and it’s short sighted that they target the base unit and not these extra efficient weapons. Is it the end of world? No, but it just means people have no reasons to the non optimal weapons when there are clear standouts.

These are the harshest changes we’ve received in all the adjustments since the codex release. And maybe this is all enough. I like my army’s to be in the middle of the pack, so more than fine to have someone else define the meta and have lists designed to target.