IM+PAROXYSM

[dc0315]

If i cast paroxysm on an enemy unit, then i spend a cp for indomitable monstrosity, does that mean the enemy unit wound me on a 5+ or is paroxysm wasted and he can wound me on a 4+ due to IM?

TIA.

[piersonsmuppet]

IM is unmodified wound rolls and Paroxysm modifies the wound roll. On an IM'd monster Paroxysm will only modify wound rolls of 4-6 since rolls of 1-3 have already failed.

[dc0315]

Oct 5, 2022 23:50:42 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

IM is unmodified wound rolls and Paroxysm modifies the wound roll. On an IM'd monster Paroxysm will only modify wound rolls of 4-6 since rolls of 1-3 have already failed.

Sooo since parixysm modifies rolls of 4-6 that means that 4s fail and only 5+ wounds go through?

[No One]

...No. Is it an unmodified 1-3? Fails. Otherwise, IM does nothing. Since parox modifies it, then by definition whatever value you've got after applying parox is a modified value, and has no interaction with IM.

(If it actually wounds on a 4, then sure, but I'm pretty sure that's not what you're asking here).

[piersonsmuppet]

Oct 6, 2022 6:44:25 GMT dc0315 said:

Sooo since parixysm modifies rolls of 4-6 that means that 4s fail and only 5+ wounds go through?

IM will make unmodified rolls 1-3’s fail. Paroxysm will turn all the unmodified 4-6’s into modified 3-5’s. Then the S/T gets compared and fail/success occurs as normal.

[dc0315]

Oct 6, 2022 18:50:10 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

Oct 6, 2022 6:44:25 GMT dc0315 said:

Sooo since parixysm modifies rolls of 4-6 that means that 4s fail and only 5+ wounds go through?

IM will make unmodified rolls 1-3’s fail. Paroxysm will turn all the unmodified 4-6’s into modified 3-5’s. Then the S/T gets compared and fail/success occurs as normal.

Sooooo, in layman's terms...against 1 particular unit in melee, my monster would only be wounded on 5s & 6s if i pop IM on the monster+PAROXYSM on that 1 enemy unit?

[piersonsmuppet]

Oct 7, 2022 17:19:44 GMT dc0315 said:

Sooooo, in layman's terms...against 1 particular unit in melee, my monster would only be wounded on 5s & 6s if i pop IM on the monster+PAROXYSM on that 1 enemy unit?

The monster will only be wounded on 5's and 6's with Paroxysm if the unit would have wounded on 4's after modification, in which case IM does nothing. Example:

T7 vs S8 - normally wounds on 3+, IM causes all unmodified 1-3 wound rolls to fail. Paroxysm would cause unmodified wound rolls of 1-3 to fail. An unmodified 4 becomes a modified 3 and successfully wounds (all rolls that succeeded through IM still succeed through Paroxysm).

T8 vs S8 - normally wounds on 4+, IM causes all unmodified 1-3 wound rolls to fail. Paroxysm causes unmodified 1-4 wound rolls to fail. An unmodified 4 becomes a modified 3 and fails to wound (IM does nothing).

T8 vs S7 - normally wounds on 5+, IM causes all unmodified 1-3 wound rolls to fail. Paroxysm causes unmodified 1-5 wound rolls to fail. An unmodified 4 becomes a modified 3 and an unmod 5 becomes a modified 4 causing both rolls to fail to wound (IM does Nothing).

IM occurs before you modify rolls with Paroxysm, so they can never "stack" effects.


Edit: When Paroxysm affects a wound roll it becomes a modified roll. IM can't be used on it since IM only affects unmodified rolls.

[zimko]

Oct 7, 2022 17:19:44 GMT dc0315 said:

Oct 6, 2022 18:50:10 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

IM will make unmodified rolls 1-3’s fail. Paroxysm will turn all the unmodified 4-6’s into modified 3-5’s. Then the S/T gets compared and fail/success occurs as normal.

Sooooo, in layman's terms...against 1 particular unit in melee, my monster would only be wounded on 5s & 6s if i pop IM on the monster+PAROXYSM on that 1 enemy unit?

In layman's terms... IM and Paroxysm have 0 interaction with each other. Paroxysm MODIFIES the wound roll. IM triggers on UNMODIFIED wound rolls.

So when deciding which to use... ask yourself this. Without Paroxysm or IM... what does my opponent need to roll to wound. If the answer is 3+ or worse, then use Paroxysm. If it's 2+, then you want IM.