Crushing Stampede - Ravaners

[niiai]

So Ravaners have always been the ugly stepchild of genestealers. No matter how you run the numbers genestealers just are better. Ravaners are not that far behind though. They have more wounds, but genestealers are 5++.

However...are they good in a crusher stampede list? They have steadily dropped in price for a while now. And the 5++ can actually make them playable. Crusher stanpede infuse energy is also good on them. (Re-roll hit roll.)

[piersonsmuppet]

Raveners are very far behind GS... RC Raveners have 28 attacks for 154pts, and GS have 48 attacks for 156pts. That's almost 50% less output at equivalent pts, not my first choice for a T1 sling. They don't have the stratagem to weather multi-damage shooting like Warriors, so durability is still questionably swingy. Possibly a better choice come GT 2022, but you'd have to be planning RND and be okay with losing to dice rolls literally. I like the gained durability for Warriors, TG, and Pyros in Stampede personally; everything else plays roughly the same with a 5++ as without.

[purestrain]

Dec 31, 2021 0:55:39 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

Raveners are very far behind GS... RC Raveners have 28 attacks for 154pts, and GS have 48 attacks for 156pts. That's almost 50% less output at equivalent pts, not my first choice for a T1 sling. They don't have the stratagem to weather multi-damage shooting like Warriors, so durability is still questionably swingy. Possibly a better choice come GT 2022, but you'd have to be planning RND and be okay with losing to dice rolls literally. I like the gained durability for Warriors, TG, and Pyros in Stampede personally; everything else plays roughly the same with a 5++ as without.

4 man packs are just fine and transhuman only costs 1cp for them at that point.

we dont have anything else non monster that moves at their pace.

[windwalkerranger]

Dec 31, 2021 0:55:39 GMT piersonsmuppet said:

Raveners are very far behind GS... RC Raveners have 28 attacks for 154pts, and GS have 48 attacks for 156pts. That's almost 50% less output at equivalent pts, not my first choice for a T1 sling. They don't have the stratagem to weather multi-damage shooting like Warriors, so durability is still questionably swingy. Possibly a better choice come GT 2022, but you'd have to be planning RND and be okay with losing to dice rolls literally. I like the gained durability for Warriors, TG, and Pyros in Stampede personally; everything else plays roughly the same with a 5++ as without.

This is true, which often made me think Raveners' hidden niche spot was the ability to wield deathspitters AND RC together. In that case, they were worse than Warriors in offense but were just faster. Being fast made them no good (which is somewhat fixable with the new obsec strategem) and expensive (5++ can be a remedy for this). Now I think, if I ever were to include a group of raveners, I would do so with 4 raveners with Deathspitters, but withy scytals. I'm thinking of them as really fast action monkeys (and the obsec strategem would allow them to do the action AND shoot). The only problem is the limit on non-monster units. If I ever were to get more than 4, I think I could deepstrike them. Either directly, or by starting on the board and then redeploying with the warlord trait, if such a redeploy is needed.

For now, though, I'll stick to harpy/crone for the same purpose.

[bigpig]

While playing some CS games recently trying idea out, I'm coming back to the idea of one or two 3 Ravener broods. They fill that niche of "fast moving stuff" that can get out and do things, bully small action monkey units, grab random objectives, etc.

[piersonsmuppet]

I don’t really see T8 weapons going into a 4-man Rav squad. Even then, without spending CP you’ve taken fire away from the monsters… think you’re already ahead there. Their speed will take them into melee, which most threatening weapons are S4-6 due to amount of attacks. Transhuman doesn’t get the same mileage stopping 3+ to-wound, and any rr 1’s half Transhuman’s effectiveness. I’d rather have slower Mv and have the flexibility of Transhuman or -1D on non-linked Warriors instead.

As for speed, what is it needed for? (Honest question) I don’t really see action monkey. I only take ROD or Banners for action secondaries atm, and 3xWarrior/1xLictor has been plenty. 8VP is enough for if I’ve played well, and the full 12VP hasn’t prevented a loss. Other action secondaries are…maybe more suited to Ravs (Investigate signals looks the clear choice)? Move-blocking and engage bodies T1 could be okay, but those always seem like wasted points (I don’t take engage anymore either).

[bolk]

Raveners have 12" Move, 5 attacks with 2x Scything Talons, can Deepstrike, are Infantry now. I feel for 60 pts they do more than Lictors. They can actually kill something in combat.