Grim Dark Arc (theory and data collection)

[Hive Bahamut]

Genestealers. Genetic thieves, hijackers and hosts, all in one. Not what brought me into 40k (Knives to a gunfight is dumb GUYZ) but why I stick around. What are all the mysteries of this entity, and why is it so unique in a gallery of units of scary and dangerous?

Hopefully this thread can enlighten people (myself included) into the many mysteries of our multi-limbed monster. Where do they come from, why do they seem to have their own society in the faceless horde? What drives this race to do what it does? How come they chose to reproduce in the way they do? In 2021 I feel it is only fair to ask, is there even a gender divide? Does the Patriarch mutation even have any connection to fathers/males? Why does a Broodlord Exist?

The following is copy/pasted from 40k wiki:


A Genestealer (Corporaptor hominis) is a bioform of the multispecies Tyranid race that was genetically designed by the Hive Mind for the infiltration of other intelligent species' settled worlds.

The Tyranids are a nomadic xenos species governed by a gestalt collective consciousness known as the Hive Mind. The species comprises many different genetically-engineered bioforms, of which the Genestealer is but one.

Genestealers are capable of using their unique, parasitic reproductive cycle and psychic abilities to establish so-called "Genestealer Cults" on Imperial worlds. These cults are used to support hive fleet assaults by infiltrating the Human world's society and military defences from within.

Genestealers serve as the vanguard organisms of the hive fleets. The first Tyranids to be discovered by the Imperium, their true nature is obscured by a confusing multitude of legends. They are known as "Snatcher-devils" on some Imperial worlds, "Cave Nightmares" on others and "Clawed Changelings" on yet more.

Every conceivable interpretation of the Genestealer Curse has been posited across Mankind's domain, but even the most outlandish story does no justice to the awful truth behind these creatures and the reproductive cycles of genetic damnation they propagate.

By spreading their genetic curse in secrecy, these creatures multiply the threat they pose in the manner of a virus. Even a single Purestrain Genestealer, borne across the stars by an unwitting pilot who lands upon a fertile planet, can spawn enough tainted progeny to take that world over from the bottom up. Such potential disasters are seeded across the Imperium in great measure.

The spread of infestations has become even more rampant since the opening of the Great Rift, with countless refugee craft in desperate flight providing ideal transportation for the xenos beasts.

Purestrain Genestealers are also used by the Hive Mind as a primary shock assault unit for Tyranid swarms during surface and void battles.

*End*

A lot of what we know is pretty stock standard to Tyranid players (Corporaptor Hominus might be the coolest name ever) and a lot more is or has been changed throughout the years. What about things that come from literature more? I imagine many authors have had little additions over the years and this is where I fall flat. If a solo Purestrain can envelop an entire planet given only time, does that not make it the single most dangerous Tyranid? Swarmlord and a Brood of Carnifex can get plot armoured away in a single captain fight, yet something with nothing but darkness and humie hands (I love the idea of a Genestealer typing in a passcode) can topple. WELL unless Ragnar smells them 14 stories below.. (Most BS short I have ever read in my life.)

Why have Genestealers been given the fight or flight mechanic? How did the Hive Mind decide or become aware of the pro's of having an ultimately autonomous vanguard agent? What differs between the Ymgarl, Hivestrain and Purestrain Genestealers? Is a Broodlord just a reabsorbed Patriarch?

Another question or theory train that has me curious is a tie to the Old Ones. (I hate the idea Nids from Necrons/Old Ones just to be clear.) If Genestealers really do have the genetic material of many species in each individual, and their "curse" is eternal hunger... Is this not just a backup reabsorption plan? Think Noah's Arc (boats and animals dumb, spaceship with dna vials not impossible, creature with living coding even better.) Now what if instead of finishing the project there wasn't time (sort of like fantasy ogres a bit) but instead of the project failing, it flourished with no reigns of control? (cough Prometheus)

Now what idea this brings me to that I kind of think is rad because a little more unique, is that Genestealers actually ARE the Tyranids. This is the sole creature created to absorb, replicate and copy genetic material. What the rest of the species is actually threat response or reactionary evolution. (Remember when they were big on Tyrant Guard being Space Marine, Zoans being Aeldari and Biovores being Ork genetics?!) This is easily explained in following any of the eusocial societies we have on earth (fascinating how billions can cooperate because one is in charge and drones are sterile.) The queen or Matriarch was nothing more than evolution presenting itself. The next step to a species being able to internally reproduce instead of relying on hosts. (Suck it Xenomorphs!)

Now comes the most easily explained part out of it all. How? Simple answer? Time. IF these creatures were created as a contingency plan gone awry (or even to plan,) then that would mean they have had their automation in expansion for a good well.. How long ago was the War in Heaven?

Fast forward to lore in GSC and you can see the parallel. The Purestrain/Patriarch abuses this mechanic of time that ALL mortal beings succumb to, to meticulously build an empire. For greed or personal gain? No. Duty. It is the creatures sole responsibility to ensure its species can continue to acquire genetic information. For who? Something no longer alive.. But another created in its void. Reseeding the galaxy with life WOULD have been quite easy to do via collection and redistribution.. Alas I wholeheartedly believe this is no longer the case. Much like a dog chasing cars, the Genestealers creations of race happened haphazardly without direction.

The Tyranid race we know it is actually a replication of the species absorbed used to combat threats to the species survival. In nature most if not all animals rely on melee combat, and Corporaptor Hominus (mmm Raptor human) is literally combining two of the biggest threats ever to exist in nature. (On Earth at least, Raptors and Humans have to be top contenders for sure.) Intelligence of human, with dexterity of the beast. Scary. Now apply that to all the other Nids and we get a full roster of our beloved Spiked Ribbed Dinosaur Potatoes.

If there is any merit to this, then there really is no need for a giant lynchpin weakness like a fatass queen (or oldschool patriarch which is where I want to make the connection.) This is akin to the Guard line having no eyes, because that is literally a weakness built in. Torpedo hole on Death Star level dumb.

Now another anomaly is the Ymgarls. They were a thing, and then removed because Nids can't have nice things. Mutable and unstable these seem to be a variant unlike the others. The Hive Fleets seem to avoid them but it is never really explained as to why. Was it a failed project to incorporeal some daemon genetics in? Was it something else? Is it just a stress induced mutation created by a smothering of the Hive Mind/Brood Mind?

What do you think? What are you curious about? Can anyone answer any of this?

[dranzyl]

I wouldnt put much stock in evolution for helping figure tyranids out. Remember nids absorb genetic traits but they mainly engineer their own genome to face each specific threat.

Their current form may just be what this specific galaxy requires for survival which would lead to chance similarities with indigenous species.

Genestealers seem to be a form of fire and forget type of scouts. Autonomous, adaptable (stealing traits for survival but not engineering their own), self sufficient and self propagating. In effect you release a bunch of them and they spread around multiplying as they go and when they manage to find a good target they ring the dinner bell.

Thats an 'in universe' answer, a more cynical one would be that genestealers are a 'homage' to aliens when we didnt even have tyranids and they were retconned as such much later without the writers sweating about the details too much.

[infornography]

I like the idea of Genestealers being the origin species of the Tyranid race, but the divergent genetics make it tricky. They function more as an offshoot than as a progenitor. I don't like the concept that they were created by the old ones, but the idea that the old ones retreated to Andromeda and accidentally got eaten by them makes me giggle.

I suspect though that Genestealers are more like Zoats than regular Tyranids. Zoats were subjugated and slightly modified by the Tyranids to fulfill an ... outreach role. Genestealers could easily have been a similar case but the modifications for control and obedience worked better in their case. I see Ymgarls being shunned more a result of that control being changed due to the mutations and after the fiasco with the Zoats, the Tyranid fleets play it 'better safe than sorry'.

Genestealers are what originally attracted me to Tyranids and are one of my favorite aspects of the faction.

[kazetanade]

Zoats were removed from the Tyranids line by the time I joined so I dunno anything about that - but I do recall in earlier incarnations, the Tyranid was all about engineering new products using the genetic material of things they fought. I am pretty sure this was retconned out at some point and it became more role orientated rather than "what I had for dinner" orientated, using the genetic material collected from multitudes as a catch all "nanomachines" kind of thing.

TBH, Genestealers are the only thing I really like about Nids. If GSC existed when I first started the game, I would have probably played only GSC and not gotten Nids at all until some time last year/this year (what with the faction being ridiculously difficult to pull off right now).

Now, based on the lore I can remember about the Spawn of Cryptus, a Broodlord is essentially a Patriarch that's been consumed by the Synapse Siren Call (which does NOT work at all with Synapse being a thing projected by sentient and intelligent creatures, unless they dont actually have any intelligence and are literally walking computers for the AI to work through. Which we know is described as not being the case). By the same margine, Purestrain Genestealers and Normal Genestealers do not have a difference to them - any Genestealer that stays out of synapse range for a long enough time apparently has its carapace return to its original dark blue color, so it's safe to assume that Genestealers as a vanguard organism are basically Purestrain Genestealers which have been reabsorbed into the fold when the Hive Fleet arrived on planet/near planet, rather than being newly created and sent out to battle.

Now WHY they are mechanically different in the game is difficult for us to say. Perhaps it was purely for GSC internal balance, and the team that did GSC did not touch Nids (hence why they are different points, and why the Patty is S6 while BL is S5). Maybe in 7th, GSC was already designed for 8th so the rules for Purestrains reflected this (5++ out of nowhere, which we accounted for as just Genestealers being mass produced and are lower quality, which it was then shown in 8th that this wasnt the logic behind it).

As for their origin - it's a good question. Genestealers are found on asteroids and space hulks from memory - if Nids are from beyond the void, how the hell did they even get Genestealers across the void long before they arrived? How can there be spacehulks from a whole different galaxy or whatever?

EDIT:
Then there's this in the wiki on mycetic spores - warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Mycetic_Spore Genestealers as part of the first wave. So I dunno anything.

[dranzyl]

For all we know nids could have been in transit for hundreds millions of years. So stealers geting the express route and arriving some tens of millions of years ahead isnt out of the question.

I didnt know that stealers reverted colour when outside of direct control. The notion that they are a 'shared' resource for all hive fleets is interesting or points to a main overarcing hive fleet. I dont think a hive fleet making and using stealers when invading is strange they are a proven stealthy blender model

[Hive Bahamut]

Oh nice, lots to work with here. Dranzyl : "I wouldnt put much stock in evolution for helping figure tyranids out. Remember nids absorb genetic traits but they mainly engineer their own genome to face each specific threat.

Their current form may just be what this specific galaxy requires for survival which would lead to chance similarities with indigenous species."

This is exactly what I mean. Initially they had a different purpose, but given free reign to evolve vs. not (Ala parents dead) They created a purpose out of that. Evolution. It doesn't matter at this point if someone is holding the leash or not, they don't use it. (Or Synapse)

The scout role is easy too, the universe is immense, and I imagine sending a bunch of Scouts out randomly is the most effective way to discover new areas. Once they discovered the Milky way it was game over man! That is kind of what we do with "satellites" which function effectively as an AI Genestealer. They tell us what kind of life forms are there, etc. Just less.. Fascist about it.

As for the Xenomorph ripoff, did you know Starcraft and 40k were a joint project initially? Zerg ripped off Nids, Nids ripped off Xenomorphs, Xenomorphs ripped off the Zombie Wasp. Meh. Adapt and evolve to overcome.

Zoats served an emissary purpose. Initially used to attempt diplomacy with other factions, until they were quite literally erased by Xenophobic Astartes. Do you know how to kill diplomacy? Shoot the messenger. Kick them down a well. Anything but respond with kindness. Their resurgance in the last Total Warhammer Wood Elf DLC is interesting, they have many of the same properties as the 40k ones did.

Ymgarls: So these are a bit of a grey area as I have a few theories but can't for the life of me find anything on them.

1. They were a prototype Genestealer left to mutate as see fit, instead of hard construct. This quick mutability manifest in ways unforseen. They no longer want anything to do with the instability.

2. First attempt to use Daemonic material to build a "physical daemon" or Genestealer, as chances are Tyranids never encountered Chaos before. The fact Chaos cannot be stable in the Materium manifests in these mutations. Constantly in flux, like the warp. As we know GSC can be consumed by Nurgle this was a risk not worth reabsorbing.

3. They were isolated for so long and they just developed these mutations over millenia of isolation. (least favourite)

Kaze: Right on! Thank you, most people love Nids for their monsters, GSC is where the real terror is. Fake religion (because most are real..) Very heavy implications of "forced" reproduction, brainwashing, corruption and a false sense of security. Having higher work quotas polished and shined given with upmost love to the imperium. Also, Miners are the perfect parallel to Nids, as they "seem" to struggle extracting hard minerals and so use humans to access. (Always wondered why they left anything at all)

So Synapse is kind of easy to explain like the internet. Hive Mind is servers, Synapse creatures are IP/Modems, and the Broodmind is a mini version or LAN. Broodmind operates only internally, but has access to the greater network only through certain means, usually being absorbed into the greater field when possible. If you shut off 1 modem, the others just relink their IP and continue, if this is severed they turn autonomous, usually destructive so the enemy can't recreate.

This is how I see the Broodlord/Patriarch and Purestrain/Hivestrains differ. Patriarch is on flight mode, only duty is to preserve life and stay hidden and secret. Kind of the perfect predator. Purestrain, that by corrupting tissue and creating a following creates an extension of psyche, and manifests into a larger growth. It still is a Purestrain, but given the "father" name because it is the Herald of the Cult, and giant now. Broodlords/Hivestrains have had the flight mechanic replaced with fight. When this override happens, all distinction the Patriarch had is removed and it is immediately noted in size and automation diminishing. They don't shrink quite back down to Genestealer, but are a weird in between, so called Broodlords. This means the only difference between the two is literally "fight or flight." Thinking about it too, this is why Tyranids have access to Broodlords, they are easily replicated and cookie cutter. Patriarch's on the otherhand take a unique collection of other-race psyche, mixed with mind control, so are not even an option, because once they are reacquired, they revert to the standardization model.

Also, with the scouts being sent at random it would make perfect sense to see them in different parts of the galaxy, but a united look tells me that there was a purpose.

(This is just for fun, yes I know much of it is speculation and theoryhammer. Maybe we can gather enough resources to figure some things out!)

[infornography]

I always thought of the Patriarch as equivalent to a broodlord plus extra capabilities conferred partially from their role and partially from psychically feeding from their brood. Bigger and more powerful for the same reasons the Emperor was. Not entirely due to physicality but largely due to psychic presence and power gained from the faith/adoration of their "brood".

[Hive Bahamut]

That is what got me thinking about the reabsorption process. The Patriarch is stronger, both in mental and physical prowess. I would almost wonder if it's entirety in growth is actually akin to Ork Waagh energy. The only reason it grows at all is from the psychic imprinting it has done, leaving it a larger "psyche" which is lost again once the Hive Fleet reabsorbs it.

Broodlord retains some psychic ability and some of the physical strength but is now vanilla ice cream. Same with the Purestrain/Hivestrains.

The differentiation on Brood Bro's vs. Hybrids should be noted too. This is where the fantasy vampires thing leans in heavy. Brood Bro's are under the influence, much like a thrall to a vampire. Hybrids are more like ghouls, a direct link. This distinction is important to clarify as it shows the different types of influence on the psyche. Brood bro's might snap out of it as the Tyranids come down and reabsorb their Patriarch, whereas the Hybrids only ever wanted to go in the pool. This level of devotion is unheard of in humans.

They mostly come out at night.. Mostly..

[Hive Bahamut]

Some more stuff taken right from Warhammer Community:


Whether by stowing away on a drifting Space Hulk or sneaking aboard a nameless star-faring vessel, broods of Genestealers will secretly make their way to worlds ripe for infection. Selected victims are then infused with a portion of their own genetic pattern, delivered under the skin via a ribbed tube called an ovipositor – a process known as the Genestealer’s Kiss. The resultant parasitism alters their body and mind, forcing the victim to revere the Genestealer as a messianic figure, the idol of an obsessive new religion.



A Cult is Founded
Though only the first their kind to infect a victim will evolve into the nascent cult’s Patriarch, the Genestealers will continue to corrupt the planet’s indigenous population. The offspring of these victims are grotesque hybrids of alien biomorph and their parent host. Certain features are common, such as bulbous craniums, snarling maws, extra limbs ending in viciously sharp claws, truncated tail-spikes and mottled, purplish skin. These initial hybrids grow up to become loyal acolytes of the cult, known as the first generation.

This first wave of cultists use their innate hypnotic abilities to lure others to their cause, who join the cult and later sire young in their turn. This gives rise to a second generation, who share many of the traits of first, though are slightly more humanoid in appearance.



Evolution
As the cult continues to grow in size and new bloodlines are brought into the fold, those born of the third and fourth generations exhibit increasingly fewer mutations. These hybrids are known as neophytes, and can, for the most part, pass for human. They use this to their advantage, working their way into positions of influence within the planet’s society to further the cult’s agenda.



The Cycle Begins Anew
The offspring of fourth generation hybrids are Purestrain Genestealers. Having long been under the cult’s hypnotic thrall, the parents of the mewling alien infants see them as beautiful beings, and will protect them with their lives. This new wave of Genestealers will grow to reinforce the cult’s numbers by infecting further victims, or they will stow away on off-world transports seeking another planet to corrupt.



Aberrations
Though rare, abnormalities can occur at any stage in the brood cycle, creating hulking mutant hybrids known as Aberrants. Yet even these freakish abominations serve a purpose. Armed with power-augmented tools, Aberrants are set the task of digging tunnels and clearing out caverns to expand the cult’s hidden lairs. Other mutants such as Hybrid Metamorphs also emerge as the time for war approaches, displaying more alien mutations such as limbs that end in lashing whips or scythe blades.



Civil Unrest
With each passing generation, a cult’s influence will continue to grow as its agents stir unrest in the unwitting population. The deeds of gunslinging Kelermorphs brazenly defying the law become folk legend, and gangs of Atalan-riding Jackals take to the streets to fight roving battles with local defence forces. With each passing day, the cult inexorably tightens its grip on the hapless planet…



The Day of Ascension
As the cult continues to grow in power, plans will be set in motion to rise up and usurp the control of the planet. Leaders of uncanny influence will spontaneously emerge within the cult’s hierarchy – psychic agents and charismatic demagogues whose rhetoric inflames the subculture further – along with skilled military strategists to plan the coming war. Once the cult has finished its preparations, the planet is as good as doomed…

The Brood Cycle
Now that you’re up to speed on the foundation and evolution of a Genestealer Cult, check out this expanded brood cycle from the new codex, featuring all the new units and characters:



Well, you can now officially consider yourself fully up to speed on the brood cycle of the Genestealer Cults! If you want to learn more about some of the rules in the new codex, check back tomorrow. Speaking of Codex: Genestealer Cults, you can pre-order it from this weekend, along with a host of new units, characters and even terrain, so what are you waiting for?

End*

This covers a lot of HOW it is done, but we still don't know exactly why. IF Genestealers were the "Patriarchs" of their subspecies could this not have just applied over to the rest of the species? If by its nature creating hybrids is what they did, over time, wouldn't it end up being only a Hybrid format? Using terms I can apply in real world, Cannabis ^^ Sativa and Indica (Rhudi too!) are hybrid with one or the other, and again, and again.. To the point it really isn't even a way to classify it. They are all Hybrids (sort of.) If this is true, then I could argue that Genestealers are NOT the progenitors, because there really isn't anything left to trace in that sense. It is Tyranid, as it is Genestealer. Gaunt is Genestealer, Carnifex or Biovore or whatever are Genestealer. We put words where there are but creations of purpose..

[kazetanade]

Considering the Genestealer recreation process is VERY specific with nearly identical results each and every time other than Ymgarls for unknown reason, I doubt that the rest of the swarm is created via genestealer mutation progenitors.

[Hive Bahamut]

Not an offshoot but through the process of offspring come across enough species to "use."

They needed X and used species Y because it was in the roster, but not necessarily anything remnant of its former self.

Sort of like how they use humans to extract hard mineral as it seems Nids avoid and leave rock. The Humans are not humans at all but something different camouflaged.

I will try to keep away from anything too dead end but lots of fun to speculate.

[Hive Bahamut]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVQmMmB1fPA

A video just made a few days ago that might help? Going to watch.

[dranzyl]

It may not be immediately apparent but genestealers do absorb host genetic material (hence the name). Its just that the models represent human hosted stealers.
I am not entirely sure if purestrain (the 4th gen ones i think) are supposed to be 'pure' in the sense they dont have any host dna or in the sense that they can continue the cycle anew.

[kazetanade]

Feb 8, 2021 22:54:19 GMT dranzyl said:

It may not be immediately apparent but genestealers do absorb host genetic material (hence the name). Its just that the models represent human hosted stealers.
I am not entirely sure if purestrain (the 4th gen ones i think) are supposed to be 'pure' in the sense they dont have any host dna or in the sense that they can continue the cycle anew.

Based on what we know, genestealers do not actually absorb any host genetic material. They only implant into the host - in effect, they hijack the genes and "steals" it away from them. The name is a cool misnomer.

Purestrains form once we hit the 5th generation in the GS reproduction cycle? 

[infornography]

I was under the impression that the genes are present but not coded in purestrain genestealers. When those genestealers are reabsorbed the genetic code is available for the Norn Queens to do their work with, but they don't affect the purestrain's appearance or abilities.