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Post by kazetanade on Feb 10, 2020 6:38:39 GMT
I was running +2 advance on my Abbys squad and getting them into combat from across the table, so that is actually a thing. It took a hell lot of work but it's feasible, and it's hwo you make double Abbys work.
Not to say the trait is therefore good, since it only works T1, but it actually works.
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Post by hiveoverall on Feb 10, 2020 6:50:20 GMT
I was running +2 advance on my Abbys squad and getting them into combat from across the table, so that is actually a thing. It took a hell lot of work but it's feasible, and it's hwo you make double Abbys work. Not to say the trait is therefore good, since it only works T1, but it actually works. TH works just as much with +2 on advance. You can disembark abbies from a Goliath truck then cast the spell then charge t1 if the opponent doesn’t know the trick (or he bate you into doing this, you kill his bubblewrap then he kills your -now overpriced- abbies. If you could add both bonuses, which we SHOULD really be able to, then we would have something. |
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Post by kazetanade on Feb 10, 2020 7:52:16 GMT
I was running +2 advance on my Abbys squad and getting them into combat from across the table, so that is actually a thing. It took a hell lot of work but it's feasible, and it's hwo you make double Abbys work. Not to say the trait is therefore good, since it only works T1, but it actually works. TH works just as much with +2 on advance. You can disembark abbies from a Goliath truck then cast the spell then charge t1 if the opponent doesn’t know the trick (or he bate you into doing this, you kill his bubblewrap then he kills your -now overpriced- abbies. If you could add both bonuses, which we SHOULD really be able to, then we would have something. TH works better, hence I am not advocating the new cult creed. I'm just pointing out a +2 actually works, since people were dissing the strategy. The trait is still bad. Also yuu should bait him into thinking he's baiting you into it. You can Fight Twice with these buggers, just get them into the meat of things and smash on first A, then Fight again to smash something else and wrap something up. You then use Fight When Die on their turn when they think they can easily wipe you in combat. |
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Post by hiveoverall on Feb 10, 2020 9:13:24 GMT
TH works just as much with +2 on advance. You can disembark abbies from a Goliath truck then cast the spell then charge t1 if the opponent doesn’t know the trick (or he bate you into doing this, you kill his bubblewrap then he kills your -now overpriced- abbies. If you could add both bonuses, which we SHOULD really be able to, then we would have something. TH works better, hence I am not advocating the new cult creed. I'm just pointing out a +2 actually works, since people were dissing the strategy. The trait is still bad. Also yuu should bait him into thinking he's baiting you into it. You can Fight Twice with these buggers, just get them into the meat of things and smash on first A, then Fight again to smash something else and wrap something up. You then use Fight When Die on their turn when they think they can easily wipe you in combat. Yep that is the tactic. Clever opponens (unless they have a horde army in which case they can't do anything to prevent wrap) will leave more than 4 inches between their units though to prevent fight again from touching them after first unit is wiped out. Also, many armies don't fear this at all (eldar and SM because, some or many fly, and they have low model counts)
So honestly with their new point increase, not convinced. Do you still use TW abbies like this since CA ? The good thing is that your goliath truck carrying the abbies, hidden behind a ruin wall, can now, with PA strat, shrug off ap 1 or ap2 wounds kinda easily, which is most ap values for indirect fire.
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Post by kazetanade on Feb 10, 2020 11:29:32 GMT
Gonna be honest, haven't played GSC since Sallies came out, which was just before the CA2019 release. Was playing it up to Iron Hands and figuring out how to work around their (please do not swear) - 4+ OW and deny spells on a 2+ was screwing with me way too much for me to be happy with the matchup, and the indirect fire meta was just falling off so my ground guys weren't having a good time.
Once I saw Sallies overwatch and flamers power, I just gave up, because we can't deal with that kind of anti-charge anti-infantry pressure. That's before the nerf and hence Sallies disappearing, of course.
For Fight Twice they would have to keep things out of 6" - you have 3" on the conso, 3" on the next pile in. That's also assuming a perfect line block and nothing could get behind it to get closer to the stuff behind. No one creates lines outside of 6", esp if they rely on auras or other buffs.
Honestly I'm running the options we have on hand in my head from the new book, and there are some new things that could be interesting. Abbys with +1 to wound are actually a sizeable threat, getting wounds on 3+ against Knights and 2+ on everything else. I don't think it changes them much other than make them more killy with less resources poured in. 4+ rend is of course another one, and turning a singular 150pt unit into a blender is... An option. The setup costs almost as much as the unit, in fact... I don't like that part.
As brought up by Goonhammer, RustedClaw spell is great for HG. Drop out of DS, reroll hit, ap-3, what's not to like? Even marines are going to burn with no save (except it only works on Vehicles so... No main targets unless vs Eldar, meaning it's not even a great tool in the box, just a "decent" one that contests the original FAE Magus role).
5+++ from Bladed Cog... On who? The major beneficiaries of BC are Neophytes, which have a 6++ 6+++ from Iconward already. The guy who abuses 3++ relic already has 5+++, so.. Who is an actual candidate to receive the spell? Decent spell with no recipient is uuuuugh. If it was an aura on an Iconward then we are in business.
Waiting for the book but I'm really unexcited as a GSC player. I will probably get it cuz I like Tau and I have a shared IG army, so I actually use the whole book.
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Post by hivefleetkerrigan on Feb 10, 2020 12:36:10 GMT
I was thinking the 5++ spell on my bladed cog acolytes. It would help them survive better, but I don't know how much more fire they'd weather. I feel like I'm almost guaranteed to lose a squad after they drop T2 even with the new spell.
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Post by kurtangle2 on Feb 10, 2020 12:36:52 GMT
I was thinking the 5++ spell on my bladed cog acolytes. It would help them survive better, but I don't know how much more fire they'd weather. I feel like I'm almost guaranteed to lose a squad after they drop T2 even with the new spell. It's just Acolytes and units of 3 Ridgerunners in the end |
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Post by hivefleetkerrigan on Feb 10, 2020 13:02:14 GMT
I was thinking the 5++ spell on my bladed cog acolytes. It would help them survive better, but I don't know how much more fire they'd weather. I feel like I'm almost guaranteed to lose a squad after they drop T2 even with the new spell. It's just Acolytes and units of 3 Ridgerunners in the end Pretty much. I'm bummed about greater good as I was hoping it was going to give us more build options. It really just doubled down on chapter approved. For me, I was hoping for more ways to mess with our opponent or ways to increase GSC survivability but we didn't get any of that. For me blood of baal was great as it gave us new tactics and army builds. The greater good doesn't do any of that. |
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Post by swarm492 on Feb 10, 2020 13:16:02 GMT
I'm gonna be honest. I don't have a good grasp in how yo play GSC effectively, and with my lack of knowledge on the dex I'm still disapointed. Most of the time I hust shrug and I'll with what I'm given. But I really feel GSC was an afterthought with this book, a real shame.
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Post by xtztxtxz on Feb 10, 2020 13:31:34 GMT
Yeah I was expecting to spend a lot when I first saw last week's pre-orders, but PA5 really doesn't justify buying a Start Collecting box that would likely end up gathering dust on a shelf until the next edition and/or Chapter Approved.
For now I'll limit my spending to AT and continue experimenting with Nids in 40k. There's still plenty of new things from PA3 I haven't had a chance to try yet.
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Post by hiveoverall on Feb 10, 2020 14:08:36 GMT
For Fight Twice they would have to keep things out of 6" - you have 3" on the conso, 3" on the next pile in. That's also assuming a perfect line block and nothing could get behind it to get closer to the stuff behind. No one creates lines outside of 6", esp if they rely on auras or other buffs. Honestly I'm running the options we have on hand in my head from the new book, and there are some new things that could be interesting. Abbys with +1 to wound are actually a sizeable threat, getting wounds on 3+ against Knights and 2+ on everything else. I don't think it changes them much other than make them more killy with less resources poured in. 4+ rend is of course another one, and turning a singular 150pt unit into a blender is... An option. The setup costs almost as much as the unit, in fact... I don't like that part. As brought up by Goonhammer, RustedClaw spell is great for HG. Drop out of DS, reroll hit, ap-3, what's not to like? Even marines are going to burn with no save (except it only works on Vehicles so... No main targets unless vs Eldar, meaning it's not even a great tool in the box, just a "decent" one that contests the original FAE Magus role). 5+++ from Bladed Cog... On who? The major beneficiaries of BC are Neophytes, which have a 6++ 6+++ from Iconward already. The guy who abuses 3++ relic already has 5+++, so.. Who is an actual candidate to receive the spell? Decent spell with no recipient is uuuuugh. If it was an aura on an Iconward then we are in business. Waiting for the book but I'm really unexcited as a GSC player. I will probably get it cuz I like Tau and I have a shared IG army, so I actually use the whole book. You are right, for the fight twice, it's 6" not 3", but eavy shooters requiring auras can be kept behind tradeable units. I'd have to give it another go some time, but on some types of deploy, and against elite armies, sounds like this won't be wrapping up valuable stuff, at least not for a 300 point unit and 3 CP (and a psychic spell which bsolutely HAS to go off).
How do you get abbies with +1 to wound against anything other than infantry ?
Yep rustedclaw is good. Will most def try that one at some point.
5+++ on 6++ 20 acolytes is pretty good, though it requires sacrificing the +1 on the charge and the vect that go with a 4AE batallion of acolytes. And also, it can see play just because of the aberrant price increase obviously (hah hah OK i admit this is quite a sad reason really)
So Yeah i m just a tiny bit excited to try the new stuff, but just a tiny bit... My despair at what we got is greaer, much greater.
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Post by hiveoverall on Feb 10, 2020 14:19:21 GMT
I was thinking the 5++ spell on my bladed cog acolytes. It would help them survive better, but I don't know how much more fire they'd weather. I feel like I'm almost guaranteed to lose a squad after they drop T2 even with the new spell. I will be running 2*20 BC acolytes with only a cult icon, no saws.
That is 20 toughness 3 wounds with 6++ ; 5+++ and 20 wounds with 6+++ (iconward), with patty close by (and magus because of strat, casting the FNP 5+++ spell).
I am pretty sur this will be tougher to put down than most people might think. Won't have a huge impact though because no saws, and only one unit can be Perfect ambushed. But that is OK as I will be going for more staying power VS dmg output
The list is now ready and it is pretty sweet i think for the current ETC mission set (I.E board control slightly more emphasized on when compared to current ITC scoring possibilities).
Basically it is made up of: Leviathan bat
- prime (WL)
- BL with barbed relic
- 2*9 warriors venom canons (enhanced res)
- 1*3 rippers - lictor Bcog bat deliverance broodsurge
-Patty -Magus who will get the pre game strat
-2*20 acolytes
-1*10 BB -clamavus Custom fleet ignoring heavy penalty and rerolling mining shots - patty - jackal -3*10 mining laser neophytes -3 goliath trucks 1999 points
I want to try playing without hive guard and without kronos exocrine, so this list enable me to. It might crumble when put to the test, I dunno we will see.
Quite a lot of wounds ignoring ap 1 and 2 start on the board, then pletny of wounds come from deep strike. An anti horde army will make short work of it, yes. But other armies... I dunno we will see. Nearly everything will have at least a 6+++ too.
What this army list really lacks IMHO is a primus for the 40 BC acolytes. But I can't fit one in, no more HQ slots left.
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Post by hivefleetkerrigan on Feb 10, 2020 14:40:32 GMT
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Post by angrypomeranian on Feb 10, 2020 14:47:50 GMT
You know, after Greater Good GSC book all nids staff looks super good.
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Post by dandc on Feb 10, 2020 14:49:35 GMT
I don't have the book, so I'm going off what I'm seeing online- does the rerolling to hit apply to mining lasers as well as heavy mining lasers?
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