GK Paladin Bombs. How to Deal?

[viral]

Whats your most efficient way to deal with Paladin Bombs? now that GK has a more focused path of army construction from recent results.

Specifically built for fighting GK expecting it.
AND/OR
Trying to keep your list balanced for others but able to deal with it.

Correct me if I'm wrong they are shooting in physic phase/shooting phase and able to retreat with their psy powers

[hivefleetkerrigan]

Can you add background here? I've never faced GK.

[viral]

Paladin in terminator armor
9-10 in a unit
3 wounds each
2+ save
5++ invuln , buffed to 4+ with Sanctuary
-1 to wound psy Buff or
Transhuman can only be wounded on 4 5 6
VERY hard to chew through that many wounds

Seeing if anyone has gotten creative against that

[acehilator]

It's one of the tankiest units in the game, there are no "good" options.

HG can reach them even if they camp out of LoS, AP -2 is good enough, high probability to kill one with two failed saves.

Exo with Pathogenic Slime kills one for every failed save, which is nice.

Or just slap The Horror on there and go to town on his other stuff.

[viral]

Is it possible to trap one of the models if they leave it open? Or can they teleport out of that? Would be worth keeping them from shooting for a turn.

[hivefleetkerrigan]

For the above, it depends upon how they word the strategem, but usually you can't stop something from teleporting our of combat.

As for the original post, an exocrine with pathogenic slime will kill about 3.5 paladins on average. That will get better if you're Kronos and even better if you use symbiostorm.

A unit of abberants buffed by a primus will kill about 6 on average combat. That gets better with other buffs (twisted helix spell or might from beyond.

You could also use heavy venom cannon fexes, but I think you only kill about one per every two fexes.

I'd also recommend throwing smites and psychic screams at them as mortal wounds are designed to chew through tough units.

[No One]

viral said:

Is it possible to trap one of the models if they leave it open? Or can they teleport out of that? Would be worth keeping them from shooting for a turn.

Yes, they can use Gate to get out of combat and still shoot.

viral said:

Paladin in terminator armor
9-10 in a unit
3 wounds each
2+ save
5++ invuln , buffed to 4+ with Sanctuary
-1 to wound psy Buff or
Transhuman can only be wounded on 4 5 6
VERY hard to chew through that many wounds

acehilator said:

It's one of the tankiest units in the game, there are no "good" options.

HG can reach them even if they camp out of LoS, AP -2 is good enough, high probability to kill one with two failed saves.

Exo with Pathogenic Slime kills one for every failed save, which is nice.

Also strat for -1 dam and Tide for -1 to hit, which hits HG/exo hard.

Personally not sure: it seems like an OK match up for my current list (HG to force CP expenditures and kill screens, acos can still murder paladins without screens, add some psychic/anti-psychic through Kronos/Shadows/lots of denies, seems OK). But I could be misjudging.

[kazetanade]

Don't forget -1 to wound spell to kill rending effects and 3++ in combat with some staves. Thankfully no 5+++.

Oh, and Abbys fight when die, so you can't trade well in combat, and Gate so you can't wrap (they kill you in melee anyway).

This unit and army is antithesis to Tyranids. Literally the only option is to HG bomb it over 3 turns, because they have to opt out of defensive tide to do damage.

For quick ref,

12 shots 3+ rr1s, exploding on 6s, gives you 12 hits, 4+ to wound is 6W, 4++ is 3 failed, meaning you kill between 1 to 1.5, so double shoot kills 2. Gotta do it long enough to burn all his CP and no more trans/dam reduc strategems then you have a chance. That's not realistic in any game.

Acos will get 60A, 56H, 28-30W, almost everything is 3+/3++, so 10W goes through for 3 dead. The 3 dead models hit back for 3+ rr1s and 3+ to wound 5A each, losing 12 models, then the rest of the unit hits for unit wipe.

[No One]

kazetanade said:

12 shots 3+ rr1s, exploding on 6s, gives you 12 hits, 4+ to wound is 6W, 4++ is 3 failed, meaning you kill between 1 to 1.5, so double shoot kills 2. Gotta do it long enough to burn all his CP and no more trans/dam reduc strategems then you have a chance. That's not realistic in any game.

Acos will get 60A, 56H, 28-30W, almost everything is 3+/3++, so 10W goes through for 3 dead. The 3 dead models hit back for 3+ rr1s and 3+ to wound 5A each, losing 12 models, then the rest of the unit hits for unit wipe.

They're only 3 attacks, 4 with shock assault. Can get 1 CP for +1 to hit and S6 for 2+ to wound (though only -1, so we do get saves), but still less than that. Totally a unit wipe if the rest of the squad gets to attack, but that's what hyp/other units are for. Not like there's a plethora of CP around for interrupt, fight on death and transhuman every turn (twice if shooting+combat). Though they don't exactly do that badly on CP, just a lot to burn it on.

Also add some saws and with metic you kill basically half the squad. Add hive guard for 2 turns, that's most of one squad. For an 150 pt unit+HQs, and HG which (as long as you can screen out gate, which...maybe not fine T2 if they go first, but otherwise OK) should be fine: another 150 unit and it's dead. Considering that the army is 2 paladins, HQs, and min troops? That's not a bad trade, even if those 2 units get picked up by counter attacks/psychic/other squad in DS.

Or Generations. Generations transhumans with a might+draw acolyte squad, and even if they -1 damage the saws and have the 3++, that's ~6-7 dead. Kronos strat on gate is an option, but they can still cast through that, and it's not like they don't have the psychic/counter punch to likely escape that.

[zimko]

If you can get them to use all those stratagems, that will chew thru their CP really fast. Grey Knights require a lot of CP to keep those buffs rolling. By the end of turn 2 they'll have nothing left and you can pick apart the paladins. Hold back your melee threats until they are out of CP. Use Hive Guard and Exocrine to eat their CP.

[viral]

Mar 3, 2020 13:23:07 GMT zimko said:

If you can get them to use all those stratagems, that will chew thru their CP really fast. Grey Knights require a lot of CP to keep those buffs rolling. By the end of turn 2 they'll have nothing left and you can pick apart the paladins. Hold back your melee threats until they are out of CP. Use Hive Guard and Exocrine to eat their CP.

I like the idea of attrition nids. Maybe bring those 2-3 biovores back or spore mines with reinforcement points like that one list did. Eat up some timely psych casts with Kronos.

I do feel if ppl don't prepare for this GK will roll you. Seems super resilient. But im not the badace some of you are

[kazetanade]

No One stock wod be halberd for S5, not sure where they get S6, but hammerhand is a +1 to wound. I would not be surprised to see Falchions to push it to 5A per guy, and there's the Brother Ancient with +1A yet to be discussed. Can be +1 to hit rr1s, 3+ rr1s with Hyp on.

Saws go into it for a 2+ rr1s (that's part of the 56H), then 4+ if Transhuman or 3+ if wound spell. Assuming it's a big unit of Saws or many saws, reduce 1 dam srat to turn it into an overcosted rending Claw (hence I calc the whole thing as std rending Atks). Assuming he doesn't have to spend any CP at all for the Pally to survive shooting T1, all that can be dumped on your charge turn to totally neuter you.

As a person that played Abbys primarily in their Cult, the Pally config is ridic good. It has all the strengths and much less weaknesses, the major weakness being cp/cpgen ratio (GSC just have horrendously costed strats, GK have a lot of good ones) and pts cost. And T4 instead of T5 when comparing to rest of marines.

[No One]

kazetanade said:

No One stock wod be halberd for S5, not sure where they get S6, but hammerhand is a +1 to wound. I would not be surprised to see Falchions to push it to 5A per guy, and there's the Brother Ancient with +1A yet to be discussed. Can be +1 to hit rr1s, 3+ rr1s with Hyp on.

The one list I've paid attention to the weapon was warding, and you mentioned warding for the 3++. If they're not running 3++, then they die easier, so...

[kazetanade]

Mar 4, 2020 2:55:48 GMT No One said:

kazetanade said:

No One stock wod be halberd for S5, not sure where they get S6, but hammerhand is a +1 to wound. I would not be surprised to see Falchions to push it to 5A per guy, and there's the Brother Ancient with +1A yet to be discussed. Can be +1 to hit rr1s, 3+ rr1s with Hyp on.

The one list I've paid attention to the weapon was warding, and you mentioned warding for the 3++. If they're not running 3++, then they die easier, so...

Its mixed. Unit of 10, maybe 3 have 3++. The rest have Halberds or Falchions.