Testing the newest formation - it isn't pretty

[N.I.B.]

I doubt Skyblight Swarm will ever be allowed in the tournaments I'm attending, it's just too unbalanced. But it's a fun mental excercise at least. I would probably go with something like this:

Dakka Flyrant
Dakka Flyrant
Dakka Flyrant

Venomthrope

10 Termagants
3 Warriors

12 Gargoyles
13 Gargoyles
13 Gargoyles

Harpy – TL Heavy Venom Cannon
Harpy – TL Heavy Venom Cannon

Hive Crone
Hive Crone
Hive Crone
Hive Crone

1993 points

9 FMC’s. Over-scoring Gargoyles that won’t stay dead. So. Much. Pressure.

[bebe]

In fact if you read the report Jim only had a chance because the game did not end early and his D-lord was unkillable. It really was not that close when you consider a guy who clearly was a bit lose in his play can take on a veteran who has a tournament hardened list with a string of wins behind him. I can say it did me make me think about the utility of a Tervigon in the list ... it was a key component in this game. I think at 1850+ it might be a good addition. It is nice to see Nids winning now, for sure. At this point I'm only trying to get the right mix of gargs in my list as they have been in every game my main force multiplier.

[fragile]

Personally NIB, I would drop 1 of those Crones and spend those points into bigger Gargolye squads.

[gigasnail]

Mar 10, 2014 12:01:53 GMT N.I.B. said:

Yup twas a good report. Here's an even better (imo) Frontline report, Reece testing the Living Artillary data slate against Tau: www.frontlinegaming.org/2014/03/06/warhammer-40k-video-bat-rep-215-living-artillery-tyranids-vs-farsight-tau/

yeah that was a nice, brutalizing victory as well.

[revx]

Mar 10, 2014 19:35:52 GMT fragile said:

Personally NIB, I would drop 1 of those Crones and spend those points into bigger Gargolye squads.

i'd probably put a bio canon on a warrior too.

[bebe]

The thing is that this formation is a new wrinkle in the 40k landscape. Truthfully Nid FMCs are very killable. The meta has survived night scythe spam, five riptide lists, 2++ jetseer councils, OP buffmanders and more. There will be answers found for skyblight soon enough as the FMCs are just not that tough. A quad gun will kill one. A stalker will take one down. Wave Serpents can down them. Answers are everywhere. What I like is that if you end up altering lists - and people will have to - then the playing field levels a bit as you include less optimal units against other builds. Gargs returning just counter windrider bikes and night scythe warriors. We can score and they cannot with objective secured. Against other lists the gargs will be contested by non-scoring units or taken out on turn five or six. Adjustments will be made. This is no way detracts from the raw power of the build. It will be a top tier list but it will have its losses.

Living artillery is good but no way near as strong as Skyblight. It was nice match they played but against top lists living artillery will fail. It is a great casual list though. Skyblight is not a casual list. It is tournament hard.

[coredump]

Not sure how powerful the artillery formation was for that game. It didn't help him with FOC, so it was only the rerolls. Getting to reroll those blasts is helpful, but I can't see it being all that game altering.


Hmmm... I just went and reread the multi-barrage rules. It looks like you get to reroll the directional die for all 3 biovore blasts... so I guess that is pretty darn useful.

Still don't see it being *that* big of a change, but definitely helpful.

[gigasnail]

it did let him take 3 fexes separately and spread them out instead of having to brood up.

[coredump]

Mar 10, 2014 23:52:40 GMT bebe said:

The thing is that this formation is a new wrinkle in the 40k landscape. Truthfully Nid FMCs are very killable. The meta has survived night scythe spam, five riptide lists, 2++ jetseer councils, OP buffmanders and more. There will be answers found for skyblight soon enough as the FMCs are just not that tough. A quad gun will kill one. A stalker will take one down. Wave Serpents can down them. Answers are everywhere.

I have been saying this here and elsewhere... A couple of weeks ago, harpies were a laughing stock, crones were fragile, and devilflyrants were good but overpriced. Now it is supposed to be some OP powerhouse?

People are concernd about a brood of T3 models with 6+ saves, that need synapse or will go catatonic.

There seem to be plenty of options to deal with this list.



OTOH, as was mentioned to me elsewhere.... if you play an army, it is much easier for you to identify its weaknesses and know how to kill it. It also makes you likely to overestimate any vulnerabilities.

[coredump]

Mar 11, 2014 0:26:45 GMT gigasnail said:

it did let him take 3 fexes separately and spread them out instead of having to brood up.

Hmmmm... I was thinking he could have gone 2 and 1, but you're right, it would have had to be one brood of 3.

Yeah, that makes a difference.

[gigasnail]

harpies by themselves are still a laughingstock. taking them in addition to the other 5-7 FMC and super scoring zombie gargoyles is a fine price to pay. i'll even run heavy venom cannons on mine just from spite.

[bebe]

I have been saying this here and elsewhere... A couple of weeks ago, harpies were a laughing stock, crones were fragile, and devilflyrants were good but overpriced. Now it is supposed to be some OP powerhouse?

Don't misunderstand me. There are weaknesses for sure. It is still a top tier list. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts so to speak. Harpies and Crones and Flyrants are not OP. Having that many in one list can be very hard to deal with though especially when 40-60 gargs are flying your way too - and do not underestimate large garg squads. So although I agree with you, coredump, that it has a lot hype surrounding it now, people still have not built into their lists enough means to take it out yet. And when they do they will start losing to other lists that normally they had handled well. That is precisely why I like these formations. It will require people to reformat their thinking and level out the laying field. That is a good thing.

[gigasnail]

i just hope the IG codex is something sane, not the level of cheese i fear (regardless of what GW has hinted that the tau/eldar codexes were unintentional power houses and not to expect that level of OOMF again. it's the unintentional part that worries me). commiting to this build is a lot of time and money. i'm going to proxy a bit with some heldrakes and storm ravens before i go all-in, though i've already called in my red communist allies for a few projects and i have another crone still in box waiting.

[way2blaster]

Mar 11, 2014 3:29:41 GMT bebe said:

I have been saying this here and elsewhere... A couple of weeks ago, harpies were a laughing stock, crones were fragile, and devilflyrants were good but overpriced. Now it is supposed to be some OP powerhouse?

Don't misunderstand me. There are weaknesses for sure. It is still a top tier list. The sum of the parts is greater than the whole so to speak. Harpies and Crones and Flyrants are not OP. Having that many in one list can be very hard to deal with though especially when 40-60 gargs are flying your way too - and do not underestimate large garg squads. So although I agree with you, coredump, that it has a lot hype surrounding it now, people still have not built into their lists enough means to take it out yet. And when they do they will start losing to other lists that normally they had handled well. That is precisely why I like these formations. It will require people to reformat their thinking and level out the laying field. That is a good thing.

Thats what i love about this i play test with 3 frends (tau, ultra marine, ig) and vs the chees list from the tau player ig and ultra have lots of hi strenght and melta nonsens. I on the other hand play swarm not a single mc in the entire army (4× blast ignore cover hurts....) so every one building on the meta at the gw let my swarm run rampant

[N.I.B.]

Mar 10, 2014 23:52:40 GMT bebe said:

Living artillery is good but no way near as strong as Skyblight. It was nice match they played but against top lists living artillery will fail. It is a great casual list though. Skyblight is not a casual list. It is tournament hard.

I'm not familiar with Tau so I don't know about top lists, but I don't think the list looked weak:

Ethereal

10 Fire Warriors with Sarge
20 Kroot, Hounds, Sniper Rounds

3 Crisis Suits, Missiles, 4 Drones
3 Crisis Suits, 3 Plasma/Fusion, 4 Drones
Riptide - Earth Caste Pilot, Burst Cannon, SMS, Skyfire
Riptide - Ion, Interceptor, Fusion

10 Pathfinders
6 Stealthsuits, 2 Fusion

2 Broadsides, 2 Rail Cannon
Hammerhead


I agree that Skyblight is (much) stronger than Living Artillery. I think it's up there with rerollable 2++ deathstar Eldar. Maybe even worse. I wouldn't hurry to buy the extra models to run it, expect a backlash from TO's soon.

Personally NIB, I would drop 1 of those Crones and spend those points into bigger Gargolye squads.

Perhaps. But I think the Tyranid beta strike will be too much to handle for me to have to worry about small Gargoyles squads.