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Post by Hive Bahamut on Dec 14, 2013 16:58:57 GMT
Strange. Everyone with their random guessing of positive is praised, with everything being completely made up, and not a single proven fact. With some of the rumours having being wild and extremely unfair. Never ending gants for 15? Synapse providing EW? Both so broken I can see the amending FAQ now.
Yet following patterns (which is what we've learned from history is inevitably repeating,) I get constantly told to quit whining? Seems like following the track record holds more validation. It is all speculation, and unfortunately my opinion just doesnt follow suit of the "oh gravy here thou come." Honestly its kind of biased, and maybe I'm in the wrong place. I didnt realize all our opinions had to be copy and paste, and I'm glad to see so much optimism, but as I've stated I am excited to see what happens. Just not holding my breath. I will remove myself from the community if required, it seems I get a lot of flakk for my pessimistic "wishlisting." I just don't see any reason to praise the Tyrant that GW is before we get our book. I still continue to say this is going to be one of if not the strongest standing codex in sixth. Even with all these money grab supplements being released.
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Post by killme304 on Dec 14, 2013 17:41:16 GMT
When does the WD land? I'm holding onto my optimism before I see these things in print.
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Post by yoritomo on Dec 14, 2013 17:41:36 GMT
Meh, you get used to it Bahamut.
If you think this optimism is over the top you should have been here for the 5th edition release. Everyone was screaming how good we'd be since our MC's got better and our gaunts were going to get cheaper.
Some people just refuse to accept that change isn't always good. In fact it can be doweright terrible at times. How has the trygon benefitted the tyranid army? It hasn't. All it did was kill the carnifex. But try telling that to people while the last batch of rumors spread.
You, my friend, are at an advantage. While all these wish listers and dreamers are trying to invent the next codex or figure out how the army works, you will still have an objective view. So when the codex drops you won't be looking for things your imagination made or forcing units to work like you think they should work. No, you'll be figuring out how to win games.
So don't worry about what anybody with rose colored glasses tells you. Focus on proving yourself by winning games.
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Post by maeloke on Dec 14, 2013 17:47:45 GMT
Strange. Everyone with their random guessing of positive is praised, with everything being completely made up, and not a single proven fact. With some of the rumours having being wild and extremely unfair. Never ending gants for 15? Synapse providing EW? Both so broken I can see the amending FAQ now. ... Actually, mostly people taking those rumors with salt and focusing on the more realistic ones. You're getting shouted down because you're a buzzkill. We all know GW is an evil overlord, but we're in this thread to be excited, not grouchy  Now, does anyone else think that big swarm deal suggests that OOE will be an HQ slot? |
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Post by attemptedm on Dec 14, 2013 17:52:56 GMT
Look, nids are not too bad in 6th. In 5th (especially at the end) there was only one build. Now there is still one main build, but you can at least make some variations on the theme and still get decent results. With the death of the light transport and the new psychic powers we got hugely more competitive. Yes, overwatch and losing outflanking assaults killed some minor things for us but overall I've done well this edition.
That being said, there are so many things in a codex that make a bigger difference then you might think and until we see the whole thing we can't judge.
1. Force organization. Say the harpy is fast and the crone elite. All of a sudden we have the potential for 8 FMCs in 1999 and below. Just having FMC choices is great. They are IMO the best unit type in 40k currently. At the end of 5th everything you wanted to play with was in the elite section it really hurt us.
2. Stat lines. Remember the broadside railgun became S8? Tau players were pissed. They may manipulate stat lines for better or for worse. T7 carnifexen or maybe T5 tyrants. You never know until you see it. Maybe all the big bugs have 5+ attacks now.
3. Rules. Both army wide and one-of. We know we'll have synapse. We know we'll have IB. We don't know the full extent of these yet. We don't know if we get anything else. Haven't even heard any credible rumors here. For one-of rules this is where things can get really good. Maybe living battering ram gives 1d6 HoW attacks at AP2 or something.
Reading rumors and getting pumped up for the new book (or depressed about it) is all well and good. It's exciting for me to think about being able to play my nids differently for a while. But no matter how credible the source it's all just rumors until release day and even then it'll take a few months for really solid competitive strategies to start coming together. Read the rumors. Enjoy or complain. But try not to get too worked up until the book drops.
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Post by Hive Bahamut on Dec 14, 2013 18:12:04 GMT
Oh man so lol'z. Thanks Yori it really is good to know vets like yourself and Core see it as well. The thing is I'm not here to buzz kill anything and to be honest the two examples I gave were just 2 of the worst. There have been so many. Nevermind the old wish listing and early stage rumours... I love when people cherry pick just right so their defense works. I don't want a broken band wagon codex, that is why I'm so against all this. I play this game for fun, and if my responses are buzz killing anyone maybe you need to chill out. We are literally talking about plastic dolls that we've invested stupid amounts of time in. I just want the game to continue to be fun, as lately dropping double Flyrant double terv + accessories is just bland boring. Not super underpowered. Just boring. As much as I love internet tough guys, we are a community. If you don't like what someone has to say be mature about it, seems pretty childish to lash out at other Nid players. That being said if people could quit telling me I'm stupid because I don't conform to their behaviour I can quit derailing this thread  |
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Post by vecuu on Dec 14, 2013 18:19:41 GMT
I agree that the wish-listing in here has gotten a little out of hand, but I don't blame people for getting excited.
My wishlist hasn't changed much over the last couple of months:
Cheaper Gants? Confirmed
Cheaper Fexen (Carni & Tyranno)? Confirmed
Warriors less susceptible to instant-death? Unconfirmed, unlikely, but possible
More expensive Tervigons? Semi-confirmed (more expensive base cost, potentially powerful cheap upgrades).
That single point shaved off of each Termagant is massive for me, as is the change to Carnifexen (mixed weapon broods means you can take two heavily upgraded Fexen, with one bare-bones as a meat shield).
Cheaper Gants improves Swarm, and the combination of more expensive Tervigons and cheaper Fexen means that you get more versatility with Nidzilla (although still potentially leaving the option for Tervigon spam [which I don't and won't play]).
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Post by jocke01 on Dec 14, 2013 18:50:40 GMT
Wishlisting and threats about selling their army happen just as much in the rumour thread of the 5th edition codex a few years back.
I said after reading the 5th codex for the first time to ignore rumours before the codex release next time too avoid being dissapointed but we all know we can't, we just have to know. The thing is that we are all exited for what will and will not change in the codex and this unknowing and exitment is making us yell Boo or Yay at every piece of information that becomes available without knowing if it's true or not.
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Post by Davor on Dec 14, 2013 18:51:26 GMT
Strange. Everyone with their random guessing of positive is praised, with everything being completely made up, and not a single proven fact. With some of the rumours having being wild and extremely unfair. Never ending gants for 15? Synapse providing EW? Both so broken I can see the amending FAQ now. Yet following patterns (which is what we've learned from history is inevitably repeating,) I get constantly told to quit whining? Seems like following the track record holds more validation. It is all speculation, and unfortunately my opinion just doesnt follow suit of the "oh gravy here thou come." Honestly its kind of biased, and maybe I'm in the wrong place. I didnt realize all our opinions had to be copy and paste, and I'm glad to see so much optimism, but as I've stated I am excited to see what happens. Just not holding my breath. I will remove myself from the community if required, it seems I get a lot of flakk for my pessimistic "wishlisting." I just don't see any reason to praise the Tyrant that GW is before we get our book. I still continue to say this is going to be one of if not the strongest standing codex in sixth. Even with all these money grab supplements being released. Oh I don't think it's we are all optimistic, we just finally being able to get excited for something. I am sure almost 100% of us expect to be disappointed but just want to feel good for once before that disappointment comes in. I don't understand what you mean peoples opinions are copy/paste. That is what GW does.  I expect to get the Chaos Space Marine/Dark Angel treatment, instead of the Eldar/Tau treatment. We will have a fine balance codex. I don't think it will be over powered like Tau/Eldar. I don't want nothing like Tau/Eldar book. Everyone seems to have it now. I want to be like DA, and even CSM. Lots of people say it sucks, but I find it funny how a lot of DA players love their book even though people say it sucks now. Hell even some CSM players are having fun. Not a lot but some. So I am sure we will be fine with It's been a 4 years of frustration for most. For now we are giddy and excited hoping something better will finally come along. If history has anything to say, like you said, CSM, and DA, had lack lister codexes, and what they got, was better than what they had before. I am sure we will have the same thing. Nothing like the 4th edition Nid codex, but it will be better than what we had for 5th. |
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Post by Hive Fleet Ragnorok on Dec 14, 2013 19:06:59 GMT
I can't imagine the Carnifex will make it into Troops...
But what about a return to the 'fex in the Elites slot? It'd have to be more controlled than previous... and honestly, at this point the Carnifex isn't that "heavy" anymore. It really could just *move* to the Elites section.
What else would this give us? An MC in every force org. You want Nidzilla? We got Nidzilla. Tyrant HQ, Fex Elites, Tervigon Troops, FMC Fast, and a slew of Heavies to choose from. Sure, you need some gaunts... but you also have Tervigons popping more to create a proper swarm. At the new costs, you could easily fill out a 1500 list with MC's in every slot, and some gaunts for good measure to horde objectives and tarpit.
I'm going to throw this under the speculation bucket for now... but let's look at a few things. Various rumors have pointed to at least the idea of Fexen changing FoC slots. Non substantiated, but who knows. Further, as I said the Fex really doesn't compare to the other Heavy slots... you want CC? You take a Trygon, or the new Haruspex. Between the Tfex and the Exocrine, I think our shooting needs will probably be covered. This is more and more throwing the Fex into an awkward no-man's land.
If it were an Elite, though, it would really stand out among its peers.
Yes, our Elites are currently overcrowded, but our Heavy slot is about to be even moreso. And if we can ally ourselves, we should be able to fit in about all the choices that we'd want from any given slot.
Food for thought...
Ragnorok
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Post by fragile on Dec 14, 2013 19:39:59 GMT
Most of the new codices have ways to make FOC changes.. I can see fexes being moved to troops with say..the Swarmlord as HQ.
The problem is your post is completely negative, much the same as all the naysayers that claim Nids are no good now. So what if they have D weapons, or large AP2 pie plates, or every unit in their army can overwatch you. Figure out a strategy around it and continue on.
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Post by N.I.B. on Dec 14, 2013 21:20:53 GMT
Strange. Everyone with their random guessing of positive is praised, with everything being completely made up, and not a single proven fact. With some of the rumours having being wild and extremely unfair. Never ending gants for 15? Synapse providing EW? Both so broken I can see the amending FAQ now. Neverending Gants for 15 didn't start as a rumour, it was a wishlist from a dude on 4chan, and then became a rumour down the grapewine. In other words, not happening. Synapse = EW hasn't been confirmed at this point. But it wouldn't be even close to broken. Tyranids die just fine in the normal way. |
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Post by rampagingfex on Dec 14, 2013 21:40:50 GMT
Wishlisting and threats about selling their army happen just as much in the rumour thread of the 5th edition codex a few years back. I said after reading the 5th codex for the first time to ignore rumours before the codex release next time too avoid being dissapointed but we all know we can't, we just have to know. The thing is that we are all exited for what will and will not change in the codex and this unknowing and exitment is making us yell Boo or Yay at every piece of information that becomes available without knowing if it's true or not. I actually did sell all my nids after 5th. My big problem was that GW made every unit I had completely terrible, and made all the new units must haves. I went from having a completed army to having a bunch of junk that couldn't even be played. Spinefist gaunts, lictors, stealers, fexes, etc... I ended up picking up a used army because I couldn't stay away and have been having a blast with the army in 6th. My ONLY real desire is that GW doesn't do a complete 180 again. I know they need to sell models, and that they make more money on larger kits, but if they make everything we have now terrible compared tot he new kits it is really going to anger me. At least some of the rumors about gaunts, fexes, etc.. are not all bad so that's keeping my slightly optimistic at this point. Also, how do you guys typically evaluate the rumors? I've noticed a trend on the rumors that several of them mirror the 4th edition codex (for example synapse=EW), and wondering if that is possibly based on a real rumor or if it is just people with limited imagination. I mean, is there really any chance that GW goes back to the 4th edition rule in this case? Seems far fetched since that could be considered going "backwards" and I just get the feeling that would be perceived as not "advancing" the game. Any rumors on Spore Mines or Trygons? Those are units with rules in the 5E book that could be really fun and interesting if they were just fixed a little. I would really love to be able to take some spore mine units in a real game. -RF |
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Post by Davor on Dec 14, 2013 21:57:42 GMT
Wishlisting and threats about selling their army happen just as much in the rumour thread of the 5th edition codex a few years back. I said after reading the 5th codex for the first time to ignore rumours before the codex release next time too avoid being dissapointed but we all know we can't, we just have to know. The thing is that we are all exited for what will and will not change in the codex and this unknowing and exitment is making us yell Boo or Yay at every piece of information that becomes available without knowing if it's true or not. I actually did sell all my nids after 5th. My big problem was that GW made every unit I had completely terrible, and made all the new units must haves. I went from having a completed army to having a bunch of junk that couldn't even be played. Spinefist gaunts, lictors, stealers, fexes, etc... I ended up picking up a used army because I couldn't stay away and have been having a blast with the army in 6th. My ONLY real desire is that GW doesn't do a complete 180 again. I know they need to sell models, and that they make more money on larger kits, but if they make everything we have now terrible compared tot he new kits it is really going to anger me. At least some of the rumors about gaunts, fexes, etc.. are not all bad so that's keeping my slightly optimistic at this point. Sadly for us, this is what exactly what GW does. GW had to think, how do they make sales from people who already bought stuff. So I am sure it will happen again. Not directed at you, but I find it funny, people sell their Tyranids army and complain, saying "they don't want to spend more money", so they sell it, get rid of it, and spend more money on GW products by buying a different army. GW knows this so they keep doing it. They get money no matter if someone quits an army and starts another (in fact they get more money) or people have to rebuy for their meta. That being said, how in hell does the pyrovore have (please do not swear) rules though? Don't GW want that mini to sell? It's one thing people need to know when going into GW. About every 4 years, their army will be invalidated with new rules edition, and then with new codex. So one of the things people need to accept. That is why a lot of people magnetize now. For me, I just take the rumours as that. Nothing is true till I read the codex, or I see confirmation from others who have the codex and read it. I take most rumours as fake, as you can tell from what we were given in the last few months, and years,Summer of Fliers anyone? |
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Post by Davor on Dec 14, 2013 22:07:45 GMT
From BoLS. Not sure if posted before or not. Sorry if did, but don't recall a rule for bound leaping. Here it is.
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