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Post by hungryhormie on Jan 11, 2014 5:18:31 GMT
Well.... that sucks. I was hoping those stats were only there for the few non mcs that could actually take them.
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Post by zookie on Jan 11, 2014 5:22:08 GMT
Well.... that sucks. I was hoping those stats were only there for the few non mcs that could actually take them. I don't see them doing much good. Pretty much I think the are just for if you have some leftover points to just throw into some war gear. though the mace one is kind of nice but only the carnefex can take it I think. |
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 7:15:18 GMT
dunno if it's been noted, but Shieldwall has changed too. a tyrant/swarmlord in a unit with TG will autopass Lo,S! rolls. it still says a tyrant/SL can join as if an IC, but says nothing about them being able to leave (i.e. they still can't, for whatever reason they came up with in the first place).
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Post by coredump on Jan 11, 2014 7:28:57 GMT
Yes, exactly. They're a tiny bit quicker, 20% cheaper, and still god awful. No reason to take them over termagants that i can come up with. They are faster, they get more attacks in CC, when in CC they are protected from shooting. When in CC their target is kept from shooting. Look at it this way, for a brood of termagants to be able to shoot, they will need to be within, oh... 8" (so that the farthest ones are still within 12") HGuants are about 4" faster, so they would be within 4". Well within charge range. Termagants get one shot each of shooting S4. The HGaunts will get 5 attacks each S3 (Per game turn) The terms can be shot, the HGaunts can't be shot, but will get hit back by whatever they are targeting. The HGaunt target unit, can't shoot at some other unit. Gaunts used to be the easy choice, because they were already needed to unlock the Terv, were 'free' spawns, and because they often got AG/TS for free. Without the free upgrades... HGaunts start being competitive again. |
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Post by nameless on Jan 11, 2014 7:32:56 GMT
Yes, exactly. They're a tiny bit quicker, 20% cheaper, and still god awful. No reason to take them over termagants that i can come up with. They are faster, they get more attacks in CC, when in CC they are protected from shooting. When in CC their target is kept from shooting. Look at it this way, for a brood of termagants to be able to shoot, they will need to be within, oh... 8" (so that the farthest ones are still within 12") HGuants are about 4" faster, so they would be within 4". Well within charge range. Termagants get one shot each of shooting S4. The HGaunts will get 5 attacks each S3 (Per game turn) The terms can be shot, the HGaunts can't be shot, but will get hit back by whatever they are targeting. The HGaunt target unit, can't shoot at some other unit. Gaunts used to be the easy choice, because they were already needed to unlock the Terv, were 'free' spawns, and because they often got AG/TS for free. Without the free upgrades... HGaunts start being competitive again. I think you've changed you're tune on these guys already? They will defently be the best front line screeners. But what is the next best second wave. It may be more ts gaunts |
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Post by coredump on Jan 11, 2014 7:36:21 GMT
If you deepstrike 6 Spores, you can potentially get a Str 9 AP 4 hit on a vehicle or unit. 1st Spore Mine is Str 4 AP 4, and then +1 Str for each other one. I think I'm looking at that correctly. Sort of... You can DS them, then they have to survive and not get shot. Then they can move and assault, and maybe die to overwatch. They can only assault (2d6/2)" so they better be close. The ones that are left and got into assault can explode... but since the blast is centered over the spore mine, and the spore mine is at the edge of the target unit, it means at least half the marker is probably not over the enemy. Granted, still better than a stick in the eye... but lets not go hog wild just yet. |
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Post by coredump on Jan 11, 2014 7:42:33 GMT
I think you've changed you're tune on these guys already? They will defently be the best front line screeners. But what is the next best second wave. It may be more ts gaunts No, they still aren't very good; but neither are regular gaunts. We have pretty piss poor troops... kinda frees us up to experiment... |
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Post by guns on Jan 11, 2014 7:50:10 GMT
Devilgaunts got 2 points cheaper, and are just as good. But they have to walk everywhere now, which makes them worse.
I'm less worried about Gaunts sucking at Objectives now that I've had time to digest the IB rules.
In our 5th book, Gaunts either passed the IB check or ran towards area terrain. So if an Objective wasn't in the area terrain, they weren't gonna claim it. 100% of the time.
Now, if they pass the test they do whatever they want. Same. If they fail, they have a 50% chance to remain viable claimers, since a 4, 5, or 6 allows you to move wherever you want. The other 50% of the time they fall back.
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 7:51:17 GMT
if i want frontline screeners/zerg rush, gargoyles are better. hormies are going to run up and tie something up, eat bullets, die, or some combination of that. which means they're not scoring. termagants can shoot, are cheap, can still assault, have only 1 less attack than a horm and now we can mix/match guns on them giving them ablative mooks to tank for the devilgants.
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 7:52:58 GMT
Devilgaunts got 2 points cheaper, and are just as good. But they have to walk everywhere now, which makes them worse. I'm less worried about Gaunts sucking at Objectives now that I've had time to digest the IB rules. In our 5th book, Gaunts either passed the IB check or ran towards area terrain. So if an Objective wasn't in the area terrain, they weren't gonna claim it. 100% of the time. Now, if they pass the test they do whatever they want. Same. If they fail, they have a 50% chance to remain viable claimers, since a 4, 5, or 6 allows you to move wherever you want. The other 50% of the time they fall back. yeah this was why i just always put my objectives in area terrain. i have a derp moment and loose synapse, the lost bugs just hoof it right to where i needed them to go in the first place. |
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 8:09:43 GMT
i found the harpy/spore drop thing. it definitely counts as having fired a weapon if it drops bombs. pg 65, spore bomb rules.
also note they are non-scoring, non-denial, and when they blow up in combat, they don't count towards combat resolution results.
when they blow, they WILL hit friendly nid units under the blast. FYI.
and yeah i can't find anything at all says or even hints they can't assault the turn they're fired out by either a biovore or harpy. move is 3", run and charge distances are halved.
note on harpy bombing run: happens when swooping harpy has finished its move. so you nominate a unit it passed over, and place the large blast marker. scatter d6. if it hits, resolve as normal blah blah. however, if you miss, place d3 spore mines anywhere under the final resting place of the blast marker that isn't in impassible terrain or within 1" of an enemy.
the fun part is it's still in your movement phase. they can move 3" and then assault. you basically can't fail the charge (unless terrain or derp intervenes) if you place them 1" away. enemy has a choice: eat an S4 ap4 ignores cover blast, or overwatch them (1T, 1W, no save and they don't detonate when shot anymore).
biovores' spores can still charge the turn they come in, RAW, however they don't get the normal movement because, duh, they are spawned during the shooting phase.
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 8:13:12 GMT
@ afewviews "do genestelers have to pay for Scything talons? Do they offer anything that the 2 sets of rending claws don't already give them?"
stealers do not have 2 sets of RC. they come with one, as stated in the unit entry (just like trygons have 3 sets of ST on the model, but are listed as having two sets of ST).
they must purchase ST, for 4 points per model. this gives them 1 extra attack for h aving a 2nd set of weapons, are AP6, and that's it (RC are AP5, btw. i missed that last night). rerolls are gone.
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Post by coredump on Jan 11, 2014 8:28:37 GMT
Noob question re Zoanthropes. Sorry, Brotherhood of Psychers The three of them get on psychic test, roll to hit and DTW. But hit three times if they pass everything. (Which is a nerf, as you can't select a second target if you hit first time). Then do the three get to roll one more power? (as they're Mastery Level 2) WHen they roll for their (random) pscyh powers, do they get three goes (at getting a decent power?). Sorry, no experience of this. We need an FAQ... I'd set one up but bed beckons... Zoans were never allowed to fire at a different target. All models must shoot at the same unit, this codex or last codex. They did get a whole lot of rolls when they traded in powers.. thats an annoying nerf. |
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Post by gigasnail on Jan 11, 2014 8:36:07 GMT
so is the 'one or none' deny the witch roll for a brood firing warp lance/blast now.
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Post by N.I.B. on Jan 11, 2014 8:49:42 GMT
so is the 'one or none' deny the witch roll for a brood firing warp lance/blast now. One. |
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