Lictors

[maista]

That kinda makes sense. And is a most likely scenario anyways.


Oh well...

[Hive Carnithrope]

Soft, moist and tender bodies? They sound tasty!

Lictors fluff wise have always been an epic unit just for their cool 'Commando' style infiltration, assassination and escape tactics. They were used along side Genestealers in the early stages of the invasion to hunt enemy commanders and suck out their brains using feeder tendrils so the Hive Mind knew the enemies plans and tactics, a la Starship Troopers. So awesome! XD

I'm kinda divided about the Deathleaper. The fluff it had in the Codex was awesome, but I thought it was kind of redundant, since why couldn't a regular Lictor do it? In fact, the fluff even states that the Imperium are unsure whether it is a separate creature at all. A normal Lictor could do what the Deathleaper did. Tbh, I think most independant characters are redundant as far as fluff goes - if the Deathleaper is so much better than a normal Lictor, the Hive Mind could just spawn them instead of Lictors.

As far as gamewise goes, all I know is they need a major rework, alongside the Pyrovore and the Harpy.

[vipoid]

The sad thing is, this book actually had the perfect deployment rules for lictors.

Unfortunately, those rules ended up being given to Ymgarl genestealers instead of lictors.

[kujwa]

very good point. lictors should be able to "peek a boo" anywhere on the board and move as normal.

[Davor]

Aug 5, 2013 22:32:50 GMT kujwa said:

very good point. lictors should be able to "peek a boo" anywhere on the board and move as normal.

Yes they should, BUT, I see a pic where some IG are shooting at a Lictor that is sneaking up on them. Maybe there should be a rule that when the Lictor stikes, anyone who shoots at it, can only do so snap firing. This way it shows that the Lictor is sneaky and have a chance of killing him, but not so easy as it is now.

So how about the Lictor can only be shot at using Snap Fire only?

[Drogga]

That would help but my big problem is they are an ambush unit. They take a unit by surprise and with them still getting a turn to react to it takes that away from him. Ymgarls are surprising for an opponent and lictors should be even more so or at least on par with the Ymgarls.

[coredump]

Up their points, allow them to assault on the turn they arrive.
On the turn they arrive, all of their hits are considered precision. (you can pick the target).
Perhaps even ignore LOS.

Assassin units.

[vipoid]

Aug 6, 2013 0:45:55 GMT coredump said:

Up their points, allow them to assault on the turn they arrive.
On the turn they arrive, all of their hits are considered precision. (you can pick the target).
Perhaps even ignore LOS.

Assassin units.

I really don't think their points need upping. Thing is, even if you let them assault the turn they arrive, they're just not amazing in combat. They have WS6, S6 and rending, but a single lictor doesn't have the weight of attacks to make it threatening (especially if you're trying to kill an IC) - nor the resilience to attrition the enemy squad. And, if you want a squad of 3 lictors (to actually bring a decent number of attacks), then that's ~200pts currently. Paying more than that for the privilege of doing what they should already be doing seems like a dubious idea.

[alamomelt]

Lictors and Venomthropes both suffer from unit organization issues. A squad of 3 lictors seems to have no purpose and Venomthropse should be like Warlocks in the current Eldar dex; buy a group and then split them up and attach them to units as needed. But a squad of 3? What's the use of that?

[vipoid]

Aug 7, 2013 5:20:35 GMT alamomelt said:

Lictors and Venomthropes both suffer from unit organization issues. A squad of 3 lictors seems to have no purpose and Venomthropse should be like Warlocks in the current Eldar dex; buy a group and then split them up and attach them to units as needed. But a squad of 3? What's the use of that?

I definitely agree that venomthropes should be attached to units. As it stands, they're just too fragile to make good support units.

Taking 3 was possible (but probably not optimal) in 5th, when you could attach a prime. With a 4+ cover save and some wound-allocation stuff, you could often keep 3 venomthropes around for a while (and, by spreading them out, cover a decent portion of your army).

IMO 6th has killed that tactic stone-dead. For one, no more wound allocation - and arranging 3 venomthropes so that they cover as much of your army as possible whilst also keeping the Prime at the front from as many angles as possible sounds like a mathematical impossibility. Then there's the fact that dangerous terrain is now about as dangerous as a paper-cut. And, finally, there's the problem of assault being an awful strategy in 6th - so, if anyone is going to be assaulting, it's probably going to be us (i.e. no more making use of dangerous terrain and defensive grenade bonuses). Finally, the venomthropes are only going to be getting 5+ cover by being obscured by other units - rather than 4+. Which, for an already-fragile unit with a craptastic armour save, doesn't help its already-shaky durability.

Oh well, maybe if we get a 6th book venomthropes will be made worthwhile.

[infornography]

Don't forget that they got nerfed several times in FAQs making it so that they only give the defensive grenade bonus and dangerous terrain protection to themselves and not other units in the bubble.

Over the course of 5th and 6th edition they have gone from a really good, but situational unit in a highly contested slot to utter garbage that isn't worth anyone's time unless they play on planet cueball.

[Hive Bahamut]

Back when I started Tyranids I picked up two Lictors, I thought a Hive Tyrant, some Spinefist Gants, and a couple of Lictors would be a great start to Nids. Even in 5 after the codex switched they still amounted to less than 3-4 games. I then thought, Hey these guys look like Broodlords on Steroids (even same weapon loadout with Talons and Claws.) So I converted 1 into a Broodlord, and there he has stayed, unfortunately adding to the sidelines in 6th. While occasionally proxying the other as Deathleaper.

I still have to paint it but I'm quite content to use him as a pseudo Ymgarls Broodlord (I know they can't take them but he fits in squad nice.) The sad thing is the Broodlord is cheaper, and will wreck more face.. THATS how bad the Lictors are.

Needless to say I hope for an update too, but as been mentioned they are iconic and I figured I would tell how they pulled me into Nids, and how I have a frusteration for their benchwarmer status.

[vipoid]

Aug 8, 2013 0:29:37 GMT infornography said:

Don't forget that they got nerfed several times in FAQs making it so that they only give the defensive grenade bonus and dangerous terrain protection to themselves and not other units in the bubble.

Wait... what?

Is that from a 5th edition faq, or a 6th edition one?


Either way, GW are apparently desperate to not-sell Venomthropes.

[infornography]

I think it happened at the tail end of 5th ed, but it carried over to 6th. Either way it is in there now.

[maista]

I know it is not necessarily the thing to do in friendly pick-up games at the FLGS, more something for your closer gaming group, but I once used 4th ed. Lictors in a 6th ed game. Complete with rules, points cost and unit organisation.

It worked quite decently, can get imbalanced when combined with double Tlyrant/Tervigon spam though, so better stick to something fluffy.