Post by biomassbob on Apr 10, 2013 4:02:39 GMT
From the other recent thread on this topic - some things I'd like to see fixed with the next nid dex. IMO, the first thing is a focus on good internal and external balance. Pretty much every unit should be a decent choice (not overpowered) and the biomorphs should all be decent choices (for example of this type of failure look at Tyrant shooting biomorphs - the day the codex dropped devourers were the obvious choice for shooting, the odd time stranglethorn cannon but rarely lousy venom cannon/deathspitter). The player should have a variety of ways of fielding the army (so anti-tank shooting isn't stuck mainly in one slot with a couple units (zoey/hive guard)(would allow more use out of the other choices in a slot if for example warriors were better and the venom cannon was an anti-tank gun). A return to more customization such as the 4th ed dex (we have way too many units that have minimal or no choices for options). Points cost reduction for many critters although the tervigon should go up 10-20 points at least.
Hive Tyrant - it is the the 'essence of the hive mind' so show it. It should have synapse and SITW range of at least 18" and it should be a greater range than any other creature. Swarmlord should be an upgrade of a tyrant not a separate entry - ditch the unique special character nonsense (tyranids are the nameless/faceless swarm) - just make it so you can only take 0-1 of the Swarmlord upgrades. Give the tyrant the tervigon psychic powers catalyst and onslaught - Read the hive tyrant and tervigon entries and the look at the powers - these should be on the tyrant, the main leader bug. And make his mastery level 2 to reflect the power of the Hive Mind. Reduce point costs a bit for biomorphs and fix all the biomorphs that don't work very well or are not cost effective (so fix the ranged weapons as mentioned above).
Tervigon - remove from HQ choice. This should be a support beast, not a leader beast of the HQ level. Have the tervigon spawn termagants(include other variants just not devourer gaunts) and hormagaunts. There is no reason these other regular troops shouldn't be allowed to be spawned (add a point increase to spawn hormagaunts). I am tempted to remove the psychic powers from the tervigon but I think everyone would freak out since they are the current go to unit, but I think they should be limited to 2 powers max and these should be focused on the brood spawned more than other broods. And a point increase (10-20 points at least)
Tyranid Prime - I would make it the cheap leader bug for various types of swarms. Give it a wings option to lead shrikes and gargoyles and a tail option like raveners to lead those types of critters. It should be the mid-range synapse provider and leader for the swarm.
The Parasite would be better with a points reduction (maybe 20-30 points), T5 so it doesn't die from S8 so easily. Also let it have the option of not creating rippers if the scenario makes it detrimental - giving up victory points. And fix rippers - a little point reduction.
Hive Guard - a point increase to 60. These guys are great and undercosted for what you get and what they do. If the dex had other options equally cost effective they would still be good choices impaler cannon, T6, but not the almost auto include in so many lists.
Lictor/Deathleaper - no need for ymgarl. Assault on arrival, no overwatch when they attack (it is supposed to be a surprise - out of nowhere attack), keep points the same. pheromone trail works at the start of the game since the lictor (and deathleaper) are already there. Both deathleaper and lictor T5, keep other stats and rules the same. Eliminate ymgarl stealers (don't want to many units that can assault the turn they arrive). This may be to powerful - have to expect someone brings 3 groups of 3 lictors and gets to assault whatever it wants the turn of arrival - so I suggest reducing to 1 selection of up to 3 lictors or lictors become a 0-1 choice for each elite slot. I think I might add something like they have to appear within 6" of terrain since they were hiding somewhere.
Venonmthrope - can be attached to other units - don't count against slots. This unit is a support to other units and rarely gets taken because there are always many other units in a slot that are needed or you want to use. I think it would see much more use since elites will still have a bunch of good units.
Pyrovore - I would move to fast attack. Give it a 12" move. Its weapon should be a heavy flamer or a melta-stream like a multi-melta. Keep the volatile rule. This gives us an anti-tank unit in another slot but one that is vulnerable to regular shooting and especially S8+.
Hormagaunts - since charges are random now give it a 12" move. I would also drop the upgrades to 1 point each.
Warriors - overcosted and way to vulnerable to S8 weapons. Give it T5 and leave same points or T5 W2 and drop the points. This critter is supposed to be highly adaptable and providing synapse around the battlefield for the swarm as well. If they are strictly fitted CC they should be able to buy an upgrade to move 12" to stay with the hormaguants which I said should move 12". Fix venom cannon so that they have a decent light anti-tank role (the venom cannon in all areas should away from blast and back to shots with an anti-tank role). Provides the army with more versatility and these bugs are supposed to be all over doing a variety of roles.
Termagants - fix spinefists so they are the same cost as fleshborer gants or make the weapon slightly better.
Genestealers - with the current rules that nerf CC in a number of ways I would drop their base point down to 12 and drop the upgrades (toxin/adrenal to 2 points), scything talons 1 point.
Shrikes and raveners both should be same as warrior T5 same cost or T5 W2 lower costs. And give raveners option of adrenal and toxin.
Harpy - with venom cannon being anti-vehicle this beast can at least shoot at flyers and has the stranglethorn option for troops. Not sure about other stuff as I haven't looked at this thing much.
For MCs, the carnifex needs a point drop but also needs many more cost effective options. Someone earlier had a good idea with the fex being a linebreaker CC beast with some shooting options, etc. The kit is one of the few that actually came with all the bits so make them useful. Personally I wish GW never made the T-fex as its role should have been with the fex - heavy shooter (with also CC beast). Since we have more now there needs to be defined roles between the fex, tyrannofex and trygon.
Trygon tunnel - 1 unit can be designated to be in the tunnel of a trygon and arrive automatically the turn after the trygon arrives (and raveners can use the tunnel). With lictors and hive cmmander the trygon will likely be on the table turn 2 and the tunnel unit turn 3. I've thought about allowing the tunnel unit to assault the turn they arrive because the opponent will be told which tunnels have what and have a turn to prepare - but that might be to powerful.
Biovore - I would like to see the biovore go back to having different spore mine options. Maybe one type can lay smoke and give a cover save to a unit. Another could be some kind of toxic gas that prevents a non-vehicle unit from shooting or reduces its BS.
Forgot - Mawloc rules have to be fixed - again I haven't looked at it for a long time but it is not great.
In general - I would also like to see all dedicated CC units (no regular shooting) be considered to have grenades so that their initiative is not reduced when charging through terrain. So this would be hormagaunts, raveners with no shooting, CC warriors, genestealers, hive tyrant if CC only, carnifex if CC only. Trygon I would grant if it doesn't shoot first. Lictor and deathleaper already get this thru flesh hooks which should remain.
Hive Tyrant - it is the the 'essence of the hive mind' so show it. It should have synapse and SITW range of at least 18" and it should be a greater range than any other creature. Swarmlord should be an upgrade of a tyrant not a separate entry - ditch the unique special character nonsense (tyranids are the nameless/faceless swarm) - just make it so you can only take 0-1 of the Swarmlord upgrades. Give the tyrant the tervigon psychic powers catalyst and onslaught - Read the hive tyrant and tervigon entries and the look at the powers - these should be on the tyrant, the main leader bug. And make his mastery level 2 to reflect the power of the Hive Mind. Reduce point costs a bit for biomorphs and fix all the biomorphs that don't work very well or are not cost effective (so fix the ranged weapons as mentioned above).
Tervigon - remove from HQ choice. This should be a support beast, not a leader beast of the HQ level. Have the tervigon spawn termagants(include other variants just not devourer gaunts) and hormagaunts. There is no reason these other regular troops shouldn't be allowed to be spawned (add a point increase to spawn hormagaunts). I am tempted to remove the psychic powers from the tervigon but I think everyone would freak out since they are the current go to unit, but I think they should be limited to 2 powers max and these should be focused on the brood spawned more than other broods. And a point increase (10-20 points at least)
Tyranid Prime - I would make it the cheap leader bug for various types of swarms. Give it a wings option to lead shrikes and gargoyles and a tail option like raveners to lead those types of critters. It should be the mid-range synapse provider and leader for the swarm.
The Parasite would be better with a points reduction (maybe 20-30 points), T5 so it doesn't die from S8 so easily. Also let it have the option of not creating rippers if the scenario makes it detrimental - giving up victory points. And fix rippers - a little point reduction.
Hive Guard - a point increase to 60. These guys are great and undercosted for what you get and what they do. If the dex had other options equally cost effective they would still be good choices impaler cannon, T6, but not the almost auto include in so many lists.
Lictor/Deathleaper - no need for ymgarl. Assault on arrival, no overwatch when they attack (it is supposed to be a surprise - out of nowhere attack), keep points the same. pheromone trail works at the start of the game since the lictor (and deathleaper) are already there. Both deathleaper and lictor T5, keep other stats and rules the same. Eliminate ymgarl stealers (don't want to many units that can assault the turn they arrive). This may be to powerful - have to expect someone brings 3 groups of 3 lictors and gets to assault whatever it wants the turn of arrival - so I suggest reducing to 1 selection of up to 3 lictors or lictors become a 0-1 choice for each elite slot. I think I might add something like they have to appear within 6" of terrain since they were hiding somewhere.
Venonmthrope - can be attached to other units - don't count against slots. This unit is a support to other units and rarely gets taken because there are always many other units in a slot that are needed or you want to use. I think it would see much more use since elites will still have a bunch of good units.
Pyrovore - I would move to fast attack. Give it a 12" move. Its weapon should be a heavy flamer or a melta-stream like a multi-melta. Keep the volatile rule. This gives us an anti-tank unit in another slot but one that is vulnerable to regular shooting and especially S8+.
Hormagaunts - since charges are random now give it a 12" move. I would also drop the upgrades to 1 point each.
Warriors - overcosted and way to vulnerable to S8 weapons. Give it T5 and leave same points or T5 W2 and drop the points. This critter is supposed to be highly adaptable and providing synapse around the battlefield for the swarm as well. If they are strictly fitted CC they should be able to buy an upgrade to move 12" to stay with the hormaguants which I said should move 12". Fix venom cannon so that they have a decent light anti-tank role (the venom cannon in all areas should away from blast and back to shots with an anti-tank role). Provides the army with more versatility and these bugs are supposed to be all over doing a variety of roles.
Termagants - fix spinefists so they are the same cost as fleshborer gants or make the weapon slightly better.
Genestealers - with the current rules that nerf CC in a number of ways I would drop their base point down to 12 and drop the upgrades (toxin/adrenal to 2 points), scything talons 1 point.
Shrikes and raveners both should be same as warrior T5 same cost or T5 W2 lower costs. And give raveners option of adrenal and toxin.
Harpy - with venom cannon being anti-vehicle this beast can at least shoot at flyers and has the stranglethorn option for troops. Not sure about other stuff as I haven't looked at this thing much.
For MCs, the carnifex needs a point drop but also needs many more cost effective options. Someone earlier had a good idea with the fex being a linebreaker CC beast with some shooting options, etc. The kit is one of the few that actually came with all the bits so make them useful. Personally I wish GW never made the T-fex as its role should have been with the fex - heavy shooter (with also CC beast). Since we have more now there needs to be defined roles between the fex, tyrannofex and trygon.
Trygon tunnel - 1 unit can be designated to be in the tunnel of a trygon and arrive automatically the turn after the trygon arrives (and raveners can use the tunnel). With lictors and hive cmmander the trygon will likely be on the table turn 2 and the tunnel unit turn 3. I've thought about allowing the tunnel unit to assault the turn they arrive because the opponent will be told which tunnels have what and have a turn to prepare - but that might be to powerful.
Biovore - I would like to see the biovore go back to having different spore mine options. Maybe one type can lay smoke and give a cover save to a unit. Another could be some kind of toxic gas that prevents a non-vehicle unit from shooting or reduces its BS.
Forgot - Mawloc rules have to be fixed - again I haven't looked at it for a long time but it is not great.
In general - I would also like to see all dedicated CC units (no regular shooting) be considered to have grenades so that their initiative is not reduced when charging through terrain. So this would be hormagaunts, raveners with no shooting, CC warriors, genestealers, hive tyrant if CC only, carnifex if CC only. Trygon I would grant if it doesn't shoot first. Lictor and deathleaper already get this thru flesh hooks which should remain.