ryte
Ripper
Posts: 6
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Post by ryte on Feb 27, 2013 19:56:27 GMT
Well, I figured after lurking for most of the day, I may as well make an account here considering I'm pretty much completely new to Warhammer 40k, and could use a bit of advise; The tactical combat and art aspect both greatly interest me, and I kind of stuck with Tyranids after doing some research. Not only do they look like the most interesting army to design, but also to field and fight with! I've resolved to purchase a Hive Tyrant box, as well as a Zoanthrope box to convert into the Doom of Malan'tai; both of these units sound excellent, and from what I've read so far today they seem like solid short-term and long-term buys. Other than those two, however, I'm a bit lost as to where to go with my army from there. I was thinking about buying two Warrior brood boxes, and sticking to ~1000 point games until I can flesh out my army with a Biovore or some Hive Guards, but reading a few tacticas gave me the idea to invest in a Tervigon and one or two Termagant broods. Not sure which would be the better choice for short-term usability and long-term army design, but my original idea was leaning more towards monstrous creatures. That said, the Tervigon's brood-spawning also seems like too good an ability to pass up. I've been reading a few threads themed around starting off already today, and I've already got plans to magnetize my Hive Tyrant, and customize my Zoanthrope with green stuff. Either way, I'm mostly just looking for input on troop choices, since nobody in this meta plays 'nids to my knowledge. Well, knowledge other than Pyrovores suck. That didn't take me long to learn here Anyway, sorry for the wall of text, I guess I've had ideas to spare and nobody to bounce them off for the past week or so until I found these forums ^^;
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Post by Davor on Feb 27, 2013 20:19:14 GMT
As I say for others who would like to start of buying stuff, we need to know what kind of player are you. Are you an assaulty or shooty player? Are you a horde or a few Monstrous Creature player? Maybe a combination of all of them? Also is there a money budget that needs to be considered?
I would say start off getting the Tyranid battleforce box set. Even if you don't use hormies or Genestearlers, they can always be used as "counts as" something else. Just make sure your opponent knows what they are. If money is not an issue, I say get 2 of them, one now, one later.
Also don't make big purchases until you know for sure you want to play those units. So say you want to buy a flyrant. Try playing a game or 2 with "counts as" to make sure you like the rules for them and you have FUN with them. Then buy it. Nothing worse buying a mini and then not like playing with it because it's not fun to use.
You can always buy a mini you love and "counts as" to what ever you want. Hope this helps a bit. But please let us know what kind of player you are and if money is an issue.
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ryte
Ripper
Posts: 6
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Post by ryte on Feb 27, 2013 20:33:54 GMT
Right, sorry. I don't have a terrible amount of experience, but I'd prefer a mix of shooting and assault if possible; having to rely on assaulting seems like it could backfire badly against a lot of armies.
That said, I'm definitely leaning towards a few monstrous creatures, which would put me in more of the shooting category, since assault is best left to hoards. And as for the last issue, money is a moderate constraint; I don't want to go dropping $500 in one shot, but I don't think I'll have a problem getting what I need to get started.
I was a little reluctant to get the battleforce box set to be honest, for the reason above, but point for dollar, it might be my best bet starting off. And if all else fails, I know I'm going to use some form of Tyrant or Swarmlord for my HQ, so I don't mind investing in that. I'm just going to magnetize it before I do anything hasty in the design; that way I don't have to worry about being stuck with one configuration.
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Post by Davor on Feb 27, 2013 20:45:11 GMT
If you want MC how does the Tervigons sound to you? If you like them then I say get the battleforce box set. It has the Warriors you want, (again 2 of them if you want 2 boxes of Warriors) because what you don't use can be used "counts as" gaunts being spat out by the Tervigon. For me the money value saves me a lot. I haven't played much lately so my tactics suck. Hell I don't even win lol. I play for fun. The only problem I have with a horde army is painting them. I am sick of gaunts. One of the reasons why I quit for a bit lol. So I do what others have said. I try to paint about 10 gaunts, then paint a Warrior or a bigger mini. Paint another 10 gaunts and then treat myself to a Trygon or what not. For me, I love Gargoyles. Love the look of them. Love the mass of them on the table. I also like Devilgaunts, shooting 3X per mini freaks out my players. So 10 or 20 Devilgaunts (expensive points wise) will make your Tervigon a troop choice, leaving the HQ open for another MC HQ option for you. Also do you have to codex yet? Read it for the fluff. A lot of fluffy ways to play is a (please do not swear) way to play the game, game wise. Sometimes it just doesn't work playing fluffy. But it's all in fun, so what ever your fun is, playing fluffy could work, but in some times it will not work and you will have to use unfluffy ways to play. Like an all shooty Nid army, since Close Combat has been nerfed big time for us in 6th edition. From my experience, just modeling wise, collecting wise, go with Trygon/Mawloc, Gargoyles, Devilgaunts. I just love the look of them on the field or shelf. Gaming experincen, I can only give for what is fun, not too win. For Myceotic Drop pods (did I spell it correctly?) I go to Walmart and bought those Dragon thingies that come in a big plastic "egg" shaped container. My son playes with the Dragon inside and it's already painted.
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Post by ZergLord on Feb 27, 2013 20:46:51 GMT
1 Tervigon 1 unit of Termagants 4-6 Hive Guard
That's the best way to start a Tyranid army.
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Post by barenone on Feb 27, 2013 20:51:19 GMT
Welcome to the party man,
I am new to nids so I would not be much help on that aspect but I have been playing a lot of diff army's and have been playing 40k for about 12 years so I am semi competent on it. What I think you should do is find someone already selling a healthy size army for 200-500 on craigslist or ebay and start from there. Even if you do not get the exact models you want it will give you something to start with for cheaper then starting from scratch, Also it will give you some more versatility.
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Post by jahatch42878 on Feb 27, 2013 23:36:17 GMT
I am going to agree that the Battleforces are a good (cost wise) first step (I bought one myself when starting 'nids) but that from what you describe, maybe they aren't ideal for you unless you want to try to sell the genestealers on ebay to get back some of your $.
The buy someone else's stuff on ebay or craigslist is a good idea if you like that and don't mind repainting or repairing others stuff.. I have definitely bought 2nd hand models for about 30-50% less than new and been happy with them.
But, if you limit yourself to smaller games (500-1000 pts) and aren't in a rush to have a fully painted and assembled army in a matter of days, I actually think your plan of getting the Hive Tyrant, Zoanthrope/Doom Conversion, and then looking into Termagants and a Tervigon or two is a good idea...
The Tervigon army is very effective right now, the biggest issue is you'll need lots of termagants "extras" for each Tervigon you field...
but an army of a Flyrant, Zoanthrope/Doom, Tervigon, 2 units of Termagants &/or Devilgaunts, Hive Guard, Biovores +/- something else (warriors, gargoyles, what ever else you like) will be more than 1000 pts in all likelihood and will be a good army to paint and play...
You say you are new to 40K, what games have you played? You mention modeling the Doom with greenstuff, have you done other sculpting?
And finally, are you an ultra-competitive player who has to win or do you more enjoy the social aspect and the miniature building/painting?
But, I think your approach (get the stuff you like) is actually a good plan for most players (as long as they keep $ in mind) because at least right now, everything you have said you like (other than maybe the warriors) is actually really good for the long run so you won't be making any mistakes off the bat.
(and as far as warriors go, I just like 'em, even if they aren't great right now, so I still use 'em and enjoy painting them, even if they aren't the best option .. but they are troops, so at least they do serve multiple purposes on the table besides being target practice for every strength 8 weapon on the table)..
Lol, and welcome!!! - Josh
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ryte
Ripper
Posts: 6
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Post by ryte on Feb 28, 2013 1:08:23 GMT
I've done a bit of sculpting before, not an incredible amount, but enough to (hopefully) not murder the Zoanthrope; as for games, this is the first real tabletop game I've played, but I've played a fair bit of D&D, and a number of more tactical video games, so concepts like armor and cover aren't that foreign to me. I just need to give the Codex a good read-through or two to familiarize myself with the different unit statistics. And for the competitive part... I enjoy winning, but the only way I'll really be upset if I lose is if I just get absolutely curb-stomped; so long as I can learn something from a loss I'm just as happy as if I had won.
Also, I ended up getting a Battleforce after all; I figure that it'll be a good point to start learning from, and if I do get a Tervigon in the near future, I can just use the leftovers as stand-ins for backup Termigants, plus it'll be a good way to determine exactly what army configuration will best suit my play style, since I'm going to end up with a fairly diverse collection for starting off. And depending on how successful I am with my Zoanthrope, I can maybe even make the Warriors into Hive Guards!
Anyway, thanks for the advise, and the welcome!
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Post by jahatch42878 on Feb 28, 2013 1:59:03 GMT
I actually was wondering about that Warrior to Hive Guard Conversion option myself this morning... I was thinking about using the Venom Cannons that come with the Hive Tyrant and Carnifex kits and cutting them down some to make the Guards' guns and trying to figure out how to make the models more hunched over or stubbier looking... great minds I guess.. lol...
Since you haven't played any 40K, do you have the rules or someone who is willing to teach you? The only thing I guess I would warn against is that the Tyranids are a bit different than most other 40K armies (Synapse Creatures, their attack stats don't change with their weapons loadouts, they don't have a lot of "unit champions like sergeants, etc"...) but if you play some really simple small battles (300 pts with no HQ, just troops, or an elite and troops) and set up situations to learn the rules (like moving or charging through cover, melee combat, etc) you'll pick it up fast...
I guess the only other thing is try to find someone who likes teaching the game but also knows the rules... my LGS is great but there are like 12 regular gamers but a lot of them keep getting older edition rules mixed up with the new edition and then teach new players the wrong way to play certain situations then those new players teach more new players and it's like a giant game of tabletop telephone with dice... lol..
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ryte
Ripper
Posts: 6
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Post by ryte on Feb 28, 2013 3:19:07 GMT
I've gotta say, I'm kind of looking forward to messing around with the Green Stuff and model glue to see what I can do to that Zoanthrope, though maybe making one of the Warriors into a Hive Guard first to try it on a small scale might work better. And if I mess it up, I can always just ebay a single warrior sprue to replace it, I guess Also, I'm kind of lucky, because we have a relatively small group playing in my area, but a few people, myself included, have recently picked up the game, the owner of the store we now play at included! The pre-existing players have been really good so far with answering questions and playing a few tutorial games, so I feel like I'm catching on pretty quick to the mechanics of the game. I do have a question, though; I've heard mention of a Shrike unit a few times, but I haven't been able to find them on the GW site; are they one of those units that have a Codex entry but no official model? And if so, are they basically just the Warriors with wings that they sound like?
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Post by gigasnail on Feb 28, 2013 3:26:04 GMT
they're warriors w/ wings and no official model. there are numerous conversions and 3rd party vendors that sell wings though.
and if you get a battleforce, don't be selling those stealers. you're going to need them for ygmrls.
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Post by ranmafan on Feb 28, 2013 7:45:02 GMT
Yeah, a Hive Tyrant and Zoanthrope are good starting choices.
A battleforce (or 2, the Nids need those numbers!) is the next logical step. You'll want to convert one warrior to a Tyranid Prime at least.
After that, a Tervigon, 2 Hive Guards and/or Trygon should be all you need for your first few games until you're more comfortable with Tyranid rules.
So long as nobody plays Flyers until you're comfortable with the core rules, you should enjoy yourself.
Don't be afraid to try everything, including the Warriors and Genestealers. An appreciation for their strengths and weaknesses is crucial to understanding your army and those of your opponents'.
Everyone here should be happy to share their *opinions* and critical analysis on each model. Your shop should also allow you to proxy, so don't be ashamed to proxy!!
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Post by infornography on Feb 28, 2013 7:46:37 GMT
The battleforce is a good start. The tyrant kit is a good start. And the Tervigon kit is a good start.
I would probably model the hormagaunts with fleshborers or devourers and run them as termagants then run the genestealers as Ymgarls. There are guides online to convert the warriors in the battleforce into Hive Guard which are solid.
Maybe pick up one more box of fleshborer termagants and you have a solid starter army there.
As for MCs not being good in assault, I think you will find that they are some of our strongest assaulters. They don't have the sheer weight of attacks, but they have good AP and Strength so they tend to do a LOT of damage in melee. Especially tervigons with crushing claws, hive tyrants, and Trygons.
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Post by gigasnail on Feb 28, 2013 8:15:12 GMT
oh, and btw, /welcome!
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Post by FTGTEvan on Feb 28, 2013 14:21:49 GMT
Welcome! A little late to some of the advice party, but I think you've got a good start with the battleforce. As info said, if you're looking to field Tervigons and MCs in the future, modeling the hormagaunts with fleshborers or devourers is a good place to start. Personally, I think they look pretty awesome as termagants and give a good variety to your squads (or can help differentiate between squads). Have fun, and welcome, again.
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