Trygon versus Dakkafex in Pod

[xzealot]

You're right about not being able to Pile In against passengers and they cleared that up in the Rulebook FAQ.

[nurglitch]

Maybe. They're AV10 and HP2. Thanks to the 3" pile-in at Initiative, and 2D6" charge range with Fleet or Jump Infantry, it's much easier to surround and wreck Dark Eldar skimmers with broods of small S4 Tyranids. Thanks to being an Open-topped vehicle even a Venom Cannon will mess them up (and then defeat any Feel No Pain the disembarked unit may have).

Interestingly, where 240pts can buy 24 Termagants with Devourers, putting out 72 shots if in range, with 24xW1 compared to a Trygon's W6 and the Carnifex's W4. Supposing only half make range, there's 36 shots from the Termagants, 18 should hit, and 3 Hull Points should be lost on AV10. The small bugs can suck up much more poison (4+) fire.

[xzealot]

Dec 20, 2012 19:10:48 GMT nurglitch said:

Maybe. They're AV10 and HP2. Thanks to the 3" pile-in at Initiative, and 2D6" charge range with Fleet or Jump Infantry, it's much easier to surround and wreck Dark Eldar skimmers with broods of small S4 Tyranids. Thanks to being an Open-topped vehicle even a Venom Cannon will mess them up (and then defeat any Feel No Pain the disembarked unit may have).

Poisoned weapons are Tyranids worse enemy. They shred Monstrous Creatures.

Interestingly, where 240pts can buy 24 Termagants with Devourers, putting out 72 shots if in range, with 24xW1 compared to a Trygon's W6 and the Carnifex's W4. Supposing only half make range, there's 36 shots from the Termagants, 18 should hit, and 3 Hull Points should be lost on AV10. The small bugs can suck up much more poison (4+) fire.

If you know that you are going up against Dark Eldar then you shouldn't bring any monstrous creatures at all. Tyranid Primes all the way.

[Jestar]

I think a key argument here is that they both operate differently, and perform different roles. Trygons are CC Monsters that also shoot, while the Dakkafex is a Shooty Monster that also kills in CC. Personally, I use the Dakkafex. However, I use two of them and two Flyrants in the same list to give me a huge saturation of fire power.

By the same token, if I were to buy some Trygons, I'd use them in multiples and keep them together to give me saturation of CC power.

This is a numbers game; You force your opponent to deal with a large amount of your army (that has similar traits) with a small amount of his army (that is equipped to deal with it).

[leeroy1986]

I used to run 3 Trygons Primes last edition and had alot of success with them, they were effective however that was before the new Greyknight release

I tried Trygons early this edition and they just got force weaponed to death or beat in combat by other stuff I.E, Wraiths. Tyranid Gunlines are effective as they have ever been even more so this edition with the change of the vehicles rules. So I find Dakkafexes(not in pods) to be more effective.

[nurglitch]

xzealot:

No, weapons that deny armour saving throws are more effective against Monstrous Creatures. It would take something like 54 shots for a reasonable expectation of killing a W6 monstrous creature with Feel No Pain if you were to rely on BS4 Dark Eldar Poisoned Shooting Weapons. So about 4-5 Venoms with two Splinter Cannons each.

Which is pretty scary until you realize that such armament would be virtually worthless in a tournament scenario where players have to assume that they will be facing a variety of armies. I mean, anyone can tailor an army to defeat any other army. Playing in an all-comers environment is a more challenging proposition.

Jestar hit it on the head when s/he correctly identified the fact that different units have different roles in an army, and complement each other rather than compete for scarce points. My last tournament saw me fielding a Trygon and two broods of Carnifexen (and a Winged Hive Tyrant, Tervigon, Warriors, Termagants, Tyranid Prime, Hormagaunts, I think that was about it).

[TheContortionist]

Dec 19, 2012 21:09:18 GMT xzealot said:

Trygon Prime and Carnifex in Pod w/ Cluster Spines both cost 140

I wish

[nurglitch]

I think it's clear he meant 240pts.

[xzealot]

Here's my general strategy with my Heavies. I spend 610 points. I get two units of Dakkafexes in Pods w/ Cluster Spines and a group of 3 Biovores. I use the Dakkafexes to bust up any transports or tanks and I use the Biovores to clean up the infantry.