Disordered Charge

[PumpkinHead]

Going up against IG with two large blobs of guys. He mixed the units together so that when I charged him I was denied my bonuses.

We figured it would be in the rules or FAQ like the 5th Ed and cover saves with 2 intermixed units. But we couldn't find anything in the book against it. Anyone else run into this? It is another kick in the balls to assault armies, so I am hoping there it something I missed.

[nurglitch]

It's called "Disordered Charge", and you only have to charge a single unit. You just have to make sure you're only charging a single unit.

[Lanesend]

When IG "combines infantery-squads" as in the special ability from the IG codex, those squads count as one unit, not two. So you should have gotten your full attacks.

[PumpkinHead]

He wasn't combining his squads. They were separate squads that he organised as follows:
ABABAB
BABABA
So what when he got assaulted I had to assault two units and would not receive my bonus for being disordered.

[nurglitch]

No, you didn't have to assault two units. In particular, if you are going to declare charges against more than one target, you have to declare primary and secondary targets. See p.27 of the rulebook for details.

[gloomfang]

Jul 18, 2012 15:34:21 GMT nurglitch said:

No, you didn't have to assault two units. In particular, if you are going to declare charges against more than one target, you have to declare primary and secondary targets. See p.27 of the rulebook for details.

^^ This. That is a beardy trick and next time he tries it just move into BtB with the models in the unit you are charging.

Then explain to him:
1) You are only engaged with the unit that is in the combat. Any friendly model within 2 inches of a model in BtB has to be from the unit that is in the combat.

And

2) That his models from the other unit can not be moved and will get in the way of his pile in moves.

[fragile]

"""This. That is a beardy trick and next time he tries it just move into BtB with the models in the unit you are charging."""

The only problem is that if you have more units in the assaulting squad than in his front line, some of your units will end up basing the second unit when they base the one your assaulting. In his BABABA example if you have more than 4 units assaulting you will end up basing both. Interesting question.

[nurglitch]

No, really, you have to declare multi-charges. See: "Declare Charge: Primary and Secondary Targets" on p.27 of the rulebook. There is no accidentally ending up in base contact with a second enemy unit. You have to designate any secondary targets before moving models.

Even after designating a secondary target, you have to follow the rules for charging units, with the caveat that a model can only move into base-contact with a secondary target model if it can't move into base-contact with a primary target model.

The models in the charging unit will:

1. Make base-contact with the target unit.
2. Move within 2" of a model in base-contact with the target unit.
3. Stay within coherency if it can't do #1 or #2.

The units you are not charging cannot Overwatch, cannot pile-in, and are not involved in the combat. It's only the charge-move rules that allow you to move within 1" of them in the Assault phase.

In fact, you know what? If the Imperial Guard unit loses the combat and falls back, the formation described will activate the "Trapped!" rule by which a Fall Back move is blocked by friendly models. The formation described would require the models to double back, and therefore be destroyed (see p.30 for details and helpful diagrams).

[PumpkinHead]

Thanks for the help. I will be sure to point it out. My Hgaunts will thank you in my future games for allowing them to beat guard in CC.

[killme304]

I know it got faqed in 5th that you couldn't line up your models like that, and I'm fairly sure they put something in 6th to prevent it too. I'll take a look later when I have my book handy.

[robomummy]

all units must be at least 1" away from another unit unless in assault or another rule that overrides this one.

[coredump]

Nothing in 5th, nor 6th, stops this set up.

It is pretty stupid because it makes it almost impossible to move, and if you get charged, you will barely be able to fight back. But you can do it if you want.

And there is no rule about being more than 1" away from your own units, so not sure what you are trying to say.

[alphamikefox]

as the title of the thread pertains to disordered charge, and it hasn't been said yet in this thread in so many words, it might be worth pointing out that all charges that are declared as multiple assaults are disordered charges, as it says in the first sentence of the "Disordered Charge" paragraph on pg 27

so it follows that any charge that you declare as a multiple assault will mean you lose your charge bonus (and your furious charge bonus, which is under the special rule itself on pg 37) but not your hammer of wrath attack, which might make it worth while to make multiple assaults with winged nids or MCs if you can pull off the latter

but it's your decision to declare a multiple assault or not. you don't have to declare a multiple assault just because your opponent set up his squad beardily or whatnot

[Deathnid]

FAQ says no!
somewhere it sais you arn't alowed to checkerboard units. its a cheap and dirty strategy to get cover saves to both units from each other, thats why he was doing it. not to ruin your charge but to ruin your shooting.

[Lanesend]

Jul 19, 2012 2:36:35 GMT coredump said:

Nothing in 5th, nor 6th, stops this set up.

It is pretty stupid because it makes it almost impossible to move, and if you get charged, you will barely be able to fight back. But you can do it if you want.

And there is no rule about being more than 1" away from your own units, so not sure what you are trying to say.

I was also under the impression that you can't deploy your units like that, but there's nothing in the BRB to prevent that.