New Tyranids Codex?

[LordPathos]

Pretty sure GW said they were not going to make 'primarch' models just for the sake of making them. It would be only if it would 'be cool' to do so.

Now, would it be cool if every army had a 'primarch' option? I think so. Maybe they didn't want the same as Reboute where he was an auto include.

But whenever we get Emperor's Children and World Eaters, if there isn't an Angron and Fulgrim, I'll be most disappoint.

[dan3dim]

Primarch Blood Angels chapter master character.. I’ll bet you.

Tyranid get new codex? Nope.

Tyranid get supperment? Possibly but unlikely

Tyranid get updates via chapter approved? Not possible but more likely (expect the unexpected)

In my gut tell me that we don’t get anything till ed 9th. Other than Psykers awakening expansion that allow us edit ability for Nids + GSC

[jesper77]

We sure need a new codex like 6 months ago. All those things that once made our codex great has now been killed of in various FAQs or CA. This happen while other factions been getting buffs, have you tried playing an army lacking inv on their expensive stuff against an army easily getting -1/-2/-3ap on every weapon and hitting on 2s rerolling 1s. Its you picking up models..its about it. Realy think we should stop complaining about our dex beeing overpowered next time it gets released. Many of the stuff we got nerfed by is by Nids players complaining their dex is to strong. Its realy laughable now and sad 😂😭

[1b2a]

Sept 13, 2019 5:32:12 GMT jesper77 said:

Many of the stuff we got nerfed by is by Nids players complaining their dex is to strong. Its realy laughable now and sad 😂😭

I like to think that I was one of the progenitors of this belief. We need to stop flagellating ourselves and asking for nerfs.

[No One]

jesper77 said:

Many of the stuff we got nerfed by is by Nids players complaining their dex is to strong. Its realy laughable now and sad 😂😭

1b2a said:

I like to think that I was one of the progenitors of this belief.

...I don't know where you've got that, but I think the only thing I've seen being discussed as too strong and should be nerfed was MO (which...well, it was pretty much a ranged OOE: when you 1 shot a knight with it and fairly consistently bracket/kill vehicles, it doesn't exactly feel balanced). Flyrants we thought would get nerfed (and as it was, not entirely undeservedly, but other nerfs made it excessive), we weren't asking for it. I don't think we've ever been of the opinion that nids are 'OP' so much as strong back in early/mid Codex.

If you guys are referring to OA nerf, that wasn't 'this should be nerfed' so much as 'GW, fix your rules' because we didn't want to have to get into an argument every game (I know I was thinking they might actually change rules so they worked ).

[purestrain]

I think what they need now is not a new codex, but rules that can be slapped on as a "2.0" codex with a few updated costs and abilities with a brand new one put in.

Perhaps in the vein of fleets, but for those solely invested in a single fleet.

Example:

Hive fleet Kronos: Bio Barrage

Units can reroll hit rolls of 1 in your shooting phase if they did not move in your preceding movement phase.

Biological Imperative: If your army consists of only <Kronos> units, you may instead re roll all hit rolls and wound rolls for units that did not move in your proceeding movement phase. Additionally, re roll hit rolls of 1 in the shooting phase.

[jesper77]

What I would want in a new dex is the following;

Stacking powers, like - to hit. This should have been done intially, why on earth should other factions minus to hit stack but not ours? SM, Eldar and chaos to name a few all have this power stacking. Remember people freaking out when I pointed this out when our dex dropped in 8th, like it would be bonkers. Ofc it make sense, even more so when many of our enemies are hitting on 2s rerolling 1s.

Inv save on more or less all our units. When it’s now common for other factions to get -2/-3 ap on their troops shooting our Monsters have no use of their ordinary save. Give em a minimum of 5++ but would rather see 4++ on expensive stuff.

Better stats on our expensive units. 4+ to hit on a unit costing 200+p is realy a downer. Especially when so many armies have their debuffs.

Remove rule of 3 on some units our squad em. We’re monsters and critters and shouldn’t follow ordinary lines for buildings armies and it would be a fun thing setting our armies apart.

Force multipliers, our HQ choices should give bonuses to their hive fleet units. Like rerol 1s to hit and wound. More Stuff like this.

Formations, like vigilus detachments.

Some way of returning units to the board without paying points for em. Beeing able to return a 30 man gaunt unit without reserving a lot of points. Many of our troops has more or less no save to speak of and die in droves anyway.

Most likely nothing of this will happen but he’ll, one can dream right

Oh and...most importantly give back 1st turn DS. It’s a suiting trait for an army of monsters! And many of our units are designed to pop up and attack with surprise!

[No One]

jesper77 said:

Stacking powers, like - to hit. This should have been done intially, why on earth should other factions minus to hit stack but not ours? SM, Eldar and chaos to name a few all have this power stacking.

Ours do (with 2 exceptions). Regarding those, easy -2 is Alaitoc Flyers: nobody likes those. Now, fexes wouldn't be as bad as that, but not quite as horrible as Alaitoc Flyers isn't exactly a rousing endorsement. But multiple AoE hit negs? They should be dialling this back (and are, see Raven Guard), not making it worse.

Inv save on more or less all our units. When it’s now common for other factions to get -2/-3 ap on their troops shooting our Monsters have no use of their ordinary save. Give em a minimum of 5++ but would rather see 4++ on expensive stuff.

And we should be getting this when most other armies don't...why? Now, a survivability buff would be good, but datasheet invuls on what should be expendable non-Synapse is an eh way of doing it. (It's not like invul-less vehicles can't be good: look at guard).

Oh and...most importantly give back 1st turn DS. It’s a suiting trait for an army of monsters! And many of our units are designed to pop up and attack with surprise!

What? Lictor, sure. Everything else makes the same or less sense than T1 DS for other armies. This is like...the least impactful and least needed suggestion you've got.

[Kitane]

Obvious power balance issues of individual units aside, our codex still doesn't feel like a hive mind army. It plays more like a bunch of egoistical beastmasters herding packs of animals.

I'd like to see things that show the actual benefits of having all creatures on the field see, think and act like one without any concept of pain or self-preservation (while in synapse).

1) Our SYNAPSE CHARACTERS should have a way to use gribblies to shield themselves from ranged fire.
- A bodyguard stratagem for our synapse creatures. We do it all the time in the lore. Tricky to balance, maybe triggering on 4+?

2) Synapse overriding pain and self-preservation:
- Ability to interact with the damage table. The synapse overrides individual pain and feelings: all our monsters in all our fleets should have double wounds for degradation while in synapse range.

3) The durability of bioconstructs bred for war:
- Where are aberrants getting their -1 to damage from? From Tyranid genome. This should be a thing, a buff, a spell, a relic...possibly built-in to the unfortunate souls like Haruspex and our gargants. This is a correct way to handle Tyranid monster "invulnerable" save.

4) The instant reaction to the enemy attacks (again, which we are well known for "in the lore")
- All units in synapse range can perform heroic intervention.
- A stratagem for a charged SYNAPSE CHARACTER to use HI in any direction if a friendly unit finished heroic intervention within 1" of the enemy unit that charged the SYNAPSE unit (basically giving you a chance to switch places and dodge the charge)
(HF Leviathan could upgrade HI to 6", being supposedly so awesome at "synapsing")

A reaction to enemy deepstrikes should be more than


- a classic intercepting shooting attack
- a stratagem to move a unit d6" after an enemy unit deploys within 12"
- a stratagem for another unit to join overwatch.

5) We are the most expendable of all expendable armies, so why we suddenly care about a bunch of gants locked in a combat?
- shoot into combat, hitting our own on 1.
- 2d3 mortal wounds to your own units within synapse
- remove synapse in the morale phase for a target unit within synapse range that is not a SYNAPSE creature.

There are many options to make the army feel like a real single-minded organism with units acting like its appendages. And I still find the above pretty tame compared to the new SM (please do not swear).

/end of futile wish listing. We will likely wait a year or two and then get a Tyranids 2.0 update in the CSM fashion.

[dan3dim]

If I were games designer, I would made all models who use synapses become character keywords (not ‘have’ but ‘use it’).. Size of models power can control number of units equals to their powers.

All units that include synapses abilities points increased but all non-synapses units dramatically points decreased even if it can take synapses during deployment phase.
If all synapses units wipe off the battlefield, auto lose moral test to Tyranid. Same as boot to ground rule.

Tyranid do not applicable to ‘rule of [numbers]’

This will made Tyranid factions feel more swarming feels and depends on numbers with very high risk which you want take as HQ.

(edit)
what the difference between have it or use it? 
When you choose (or can’t due to there are no creatures to pick) to not use the synapses on choosing non-characters units, it don’t have character keywords to this units ( not applicable to units already have character keywords )

[kazetanade]

It irks me that SM have more buff centric playstyles than Nids and GSC, when Nids and GSC are most defined by such control and centralised command structures.

I mean ffs, a GSC has like 4 buffs: Fearless, Primus, Clamavus, Iconward. Jackal if shooting, Abominant if Abbys. Magus buff no one cares about.

SM? Cpt/CM, Lt, Chaplain, Ancient, Apothecary, special character. Giving it full rr hits, rr 1s wound, 5+ fnp/offensive buffs of choice, zombie action + ld buff + more A + Fearless, zoey heal/revive model, + hit penalties/5++/rr charges/more cp/increase run speed/whatever the character gives. The number of buffs packed in here is madness.

What do Nids get? Fearless (Lmost every army has this) and singular unit specific buffs.

Synapse should have a host of effects on it that can be tweaked, strengthened, or replaced based on fleet strategies. If we really want to make Nids unique, it will be in having multitude of options on making synapse a good and key skill which enemies can focus for an actual impact.

Also, simply stacking a 5+++ on synapse (with a +1 or rr fnp in Leviathan) would make a lot of our creatures immediately competitive, since we have an effective damage mitigation mechanic with Cceptable base stats and cost. Nids don't need to be super effective for each model, but they do need to be cheap and reasonable value for money.

[hiveoverall]

Sept 17, 2019 17:30:28 GMT kazetanade said:

Also, simply stacking a 5+++ on synapse (with a +1 or rr fnp in Leviathan) would make a lot of our creatures immediately competitive, since we have an effective damage mitigation mechanic with Cceptable base stats and cost. Nids don't need to be super effective for each model, but they do need to be cheap and reasonable value for money.

Indeed the 5+++ would be enough by itselfto immediately make our monsters ok, but 4+++ with leviathan as you are suggesting would be way too much. Leviathan should stay the same for the non monster lists.
Iron hand nids hah hah.

So no new codex needed, just this "5+++ for monsters in synapse range (and for synapse creatures -not only monsters-). Hive tyrants become 5++ instead of 4++"

There, done

[terminatoruk]

I hate to whine but I have to agree - I just couldn't believe what I was reading with Iron Hands preview- laughable compared to Tyranid Hive Fleet buffs.

Taking a look at Levithan, Kronos and Iron Hands...

Levithan - 6+++ FnP within 6" of Synapse creature

Kronos - Re-roll shooting 1's if haven't moved

Iron Hands - 6+++ FnP (no restrictions), Overwatch hits on 5+, counts as having double wounds for damage table purposes, no minus to hit with Heavy weapons, can re-roll 1's with heavy weapons (even if moved) in Devastator docrine

The power creep is insane - at a minimum I cannot believe there are no restrictions. In the latter case, I would have thought it would have been either:

If moved - Heavy weapons have no minus to hit

If not moved - Heavy weapons can re-roll 1's to hit

...not both!

[Kitane]

And that's on top of their new Codex Astartes Combat Doctrines for that extra -1 AP on heavy weapons, rapid fire weapons, kicks and punches, etc...

[terminatoruk]

Sept 18, 2019 14:26:09 GMT Kitane said:

And that's on top of their new Codex Astartes Combat Doctrines for that extra -1 AP on heavy weapons, rapid fire weapons, kicks and punches, etc...

Well quite, however, that is expanding the scope a bit and isn't unique to Iron Hands - you'd have to then include Shadow in the Warp and Synapse etc.. into the mix to compare.