Mawloc vs Trygon

[reitifoh]

I think I was debating this in a separate thread a while back and I was HIGHLY in favour of the trygon/ trygon prime with reaper. HOWEVER! after playing the mawloc in just one game, I have to admit it was highly effective, while it would have been nicer if it had misshaped and been able to redeploy next round, just 1 TFTD attack from this brute, took out an entire squad of those new satarii? or whatever they are called, and tanked a round of their shooting + a devastator squad (all of which had rerolls due to tactical doctrine) plus the fact he is 50 points cheaper....... ok I apologise to those who took the mawlocs's side..... he is a BEAST!!! thinking of running 2 side by side XD)

[krakentendrilswarm]

A Mawloc (or two) is/are usually great. Unfortunately, owing to the nature of their attacks, you will have games where they under-perform significantly and you're left wondering if it's all really worth it. They are a great answer to a lot of the problems we can face though, given their infinite range and incredibly destructive attack. For their meager cost, it's an awesome unit.

Beware of relying on them too heavily though, because you have to wait for them to arrive, then actually hit the target, then (hopefully) mishap.

[Kark]

I usually ran 3 mawlocs and I am overall happy with them. Their pts cost is ok and having lictors in addition can pay off. Mawlocs hit in unconventional way and ignore invisibility armour and cover, that is just too good to be refused. Also they wound artillery at majority toughness as tfdt is not a shooting attack. Warp spiders can't jump away.

They can also do mealstroms and eternal war objectives. The ability to disappear and reenter play creates many tactical possibilities. In some missions it is better to keep them alive and use tftd on turn 5 to clear out and secure objective at th same time. Powerful move that can win us a game.

[shadowfinder]

I have to say trygons all the way. Mawloc's under preform all the time for me. Mawloc's are a fair answer to different issues like DA jinking black knights And Invisible units. But if you miss they are normally dead.

I have had better luck with trygon primes and normal trygons for the most part. The reaper is really nice on a prime if you have a lot of other threat to allow him to get to attack.

[bane1778]

I really like Mawlocs, yes they are high risk/high reward, but when they hit they easily make up their points cost, plus they can weather quite a bit of shooting. I tend to prefer Mawlocs over Trygons.

[darkjackal020]

My game on the weekend killed a full squad of swooping hawks and put a wound on there leader i couldnt believe it and niether could he lol

[schneider]

Mawlocs all the way. As touched upon they fill a very unique niche and have the potential to sway the battle in your favor, miss and be a fire magnet, or redeploy/die from a mishap. The real winner for me is the infinite range, that combined with str 6 AP 2 ignores cover is pretty clutch for threatening/removing units that are hard for nids to budge like Broadsides behind an aegis or Centurions squatting somewhere. Your opponent is also kept on edge because of their unpredictability, and most of the time Mawlocs in reserves will still influence your opponents movement/spacing just in case they hit.

The Trygon on the other hand I feel spends most of the game playing chase the rabbit, and the tunnel is rather garbage unless you're taking endless swarm, but even then you're limited to a single infantry unit per turn so you piecemeal things to your opponent.

[Jabberwocky]

Aug 2, 2015 17:21:51 GMT shadowfinder said:

I have to say trygons all the way. Mawloc's under preform all the time for me. Mawloc's are a fair answer to different issues like DA jinking black knights And Invisible units. But if you miss they are normally dead.

I have had better luck with trygon primes and normal trygons for the most part. The reaper is really nice on a prime if you have a lot of other threat to allow him to get to attack.

Anything that kills a mawloc kills a trygon exactly the same. The trygon either deepstrikes in or makes the slow shuffle across the board, coming into fire range a turn before assault range at a minimum.

[mattblowers]

Mawloc is a unit I want to love but the unreliability of it just doesn't work out for me. If it hits, it hits hard. More likely that it derps and nicks a unit and then sits there stupidly for a turn. If either it or the trygon could charge after deep striking, then they would be ace.

[nikh]

A Trygon Prime with a Reaper comes to 275 points, which is only 5 points shy of letting you take 2 Mawlocs. Not really a difficult decision imo.

[mattblowers]

Aug 3, 2015 13:57:58 GMT nikh said:

A Trygon Prime with a Reaper comes to 275 points, which is only 5 points shy of letting you take 2 Mawlocs. Not really a difficult decision imo.

But it's not apples and apples. Sure, they are from the same kit, but are no more alike than a tervigon and tyrannofex. Way different roles. Trygon prime can work with the subterranean assault formation. Otherwise I never use it. The subterranean is amazing when it works. The new necron, space marine, and eldar codexes ruined it though. It did really well for me the first quarter of this year.

[Deleted]

mawloc.

We have better creatures for CC if you want to go trygon route. Hell for a similar points cost you could even deepstrike a flyrant.

The mawloc offers a solution to game mechanics the trygon can't even begin to touch:
A) invisibility. You can avoid that mechanic with their blast.
B) Jink. You can avoid that mechanic with their blast.


Other pro's for the mawloc camp include:
A) points cost compared to trygon
B) where if a trygon survives it's deepstrike and turn of obligatory enemy fire(both provide target saturation with the same defensive profile), then dies horribly after maybe a single combat, the mawloc can re-enter reserves and get more use later.
C) the ability, via the blast, to do damage to DURABLE and scary units like wraithguard before they even get a chance to retaliate. This is anecdotal, but nothing says F U eldar like seeing multiple wraithguard roll over and die instantly. 

General cons for the trygon and prime:
A) Trygon prime is 10 points shy of the "standard" Devil-flyrant. Flyrant can also deepstrike(though obviously restricted by swooping), or can just move upfield. Both are forward synapse. Yes there's a wound difference but one also has jink and psychic powers(possibly FnP).
B) Standard trygon is about as much as a CC flyrant.
C) Standard trygon is about as much as a Dimacheron
D) like many of our CC creatures, offers no real threat other than against non-beefy units(except smash which ALL our MC's have). The strength in close combat offers no instant death, nothing special against vehicles, and just generally gets demolished by any real opposing enemy CC units.

[nikh]

Aug 3, 2015 14:13:11 GMT mattblowers said:

Aug 3, 2015 13:57:58 GMT nikh said:

A Trygon Prime with a Reaper comes to 275 points, which is only 5 points shy of letting you take 2 Mawlocs. Not really a difficult decision imo.

But it's not apples and apples. Sure, they are from the same kit, but are no more alike than a tervigon and tyrannofex. Way different roles. Trygon prime can work with the subterranean assault formation. Otherwise I never use it. The subterranean is amazing when it works. The new necron, space marine, and eldar codexes ruined it though. It did really well for me the first quarter of this year.

Yeah I getcha, I used to run a Prime with the Miasma Cannon, pop up and fire a flame template that wounds on a 2+. They don't fill the same role as a Mawloc, what with Bio-Artifacts, Synapse, and a decent-ish shooting attack, but personally I'd rather have the two MCs running around, because at least when they get shot with AP3 weaponry I'm not cringing at their points cost. Even if both TftD miss, they can't be ignored or they'll devour a unit on land, draw a LOT of firepower away from your Flyrants, or survive long enough to tunnel back and do it again. I just think the role Mawlocs fill is far more useful than that of the Prime...but then again, I just don't trust high point "glam" units, especially with Tyranids.

[gigasnail]

Mawlocks all day every day, and twice on Sundays. Until there is a legit way to make them a combat threat to anything other than a TAC squad and deliver them reliably, trygon going to sit on the shelf.

[mattblowers]

I'm not championing a trygon, but I don't get the mawloc love either. Would you pay 150 ish points for an MC that shoots a large blasts that always scatters full (and ignores cover yes) a maximum of 3 times per game (although each one may be a second large blast)? I think most would not, but because of it's gimmicky nature people cheer it like a fire hydrant at a dog pissing convention. Let's face facts, most other armies probably would pass on something this unreliable. Take a look at the latest Tyranid tourney data and you'll find that our wins are in the the under 50% category. Mawlocs illustrate beautifully why that is the case. Great (fantastic even) when it works, (please do not swear) when it doesn't. I, for one, am tired of playing tyranids that way. I've been play testing a bunch with only things that have a better than even chance of working. I'll let you know how it goes. I wouldn't hold your breath.

Although we can consistently be mediocre.