We have Fluff for using Come the Apocalypse allies now.

[Davor]

Well if you are trying to make your Come the Apocalypse allies fluffy, some how incorporate the Ymgarl fluff.

They don't get absorbed once they do their job and they are basically left alone to their own will. So to me I would take this as CtA for Ymgarls then. So maybe the "allies" have a Ymgarl gene in there so the Hive Minde knows they need to be used but can't be trusted as in the same way Ymgarls can't be trusted.

I know what I said is not that great, but hopefully it will start some ideas for yourselves and you can start actually make new fluffy allies.

If you have any leave them here so we can borrow them or get ideas of your ideas.

[Threeshades]

1. Crazy cultists who think the tyranids invading their planet are their crazy god's harbingers of the end times, start working to sabotage the planet's defenses. The hive mind recognizes this and refrains from killing them as long as they are useful.

2. Specialized Tyranid parasites have mind-slaved warriors of another race under their control, but the control these parasites exert is imperfect. They mostly work fine but sometimes have spasms and have to be handled with caution in case a parasite loses control over an extended period of time. This ones probably the best.

3. A new breed of mimic tyranids designed to be able to manipulate technology of other races, they are implanted with memories and physical capabilities of the race they mimic but this also makes them unreliable.

Alternatively there's always "Genestealer Cult" but i would imagine those should be battle brothers.

[malebranche]

- Necrons who want new flesh and blood bodies tagging along with a hive fleet because a) the constant evolution of the nids give them plenty to choose from and b) they'll want bodies that can fight, and nids are essentially living weapons.

- A Dark Eldar, Necron or mad scientists experiment where they have created their own form of synapse to control an isolated Tyranid force that was cut off from the hive mind.

- According to the Shadowbrink story, Nids and chaos gain nothing from killing each other so they could potentially work together to take down a powerful foe.

- A Tyranid force enters the Warp and falls under the control of Chaos. I'm sure Khorne would love nids...

- I know genestealer cults are obvious, but I have always thought Khorne would be very impressed with Genestealers. Imagine Genestealer Khornate Berserkers.

[Kyokii]

-Daemons and nids attack the same force. Daemons because to please their gods while nids eat.
The sides don't interact much because the nids don't have emotion, blood (ichor instead), and don't please the gods with their deaths. The daemons are immaterial and can't be eaten. So they don't interact until there's nothing left or they get too close to one another.

-Necrons utilize their null fields(?) to block out the warp, which also affects the hive mind. mindshackle scarabs are swarmed onto many of the nids, making a small force of 'pets' to be used in battle. Distance is kept because of the chance nids have of resisting the shackles, but necrons are a low priority target to nids because of their indigestibility.

-Genestealer cults infest many races, It's a kind of cruise control. I like the ymgarl cults as Threeshades pointed out, though.


Edit: OH! I remember there's an old fluff story about an inquisitor investigating dead worlds before Tyran was discovered. They found an old ship devoid of life and a fleshborer in a stasis room or something like that. He made a psyker hold the gun to learn about it.
The fleshborer overpowered the psyker's will, connecting him to the hive. I have the quote from it written on a notepad.
"I-it's alive and part of it h-hates. I-it's so fierce.
I-it's a weapon a-and i-it's alive. The bullets are alive. The firing mechanism is a-alive and the gun's alive. It's a kind of symbiotic organism l-like the martian tree-crab. I-it's alive and we-it hates you-us."
A fleshvorer far far away from any hive ship maintained a very weak connection to the Hive Mind and still managed to override the will of a human psyker- someone trained to use their mind as a weapon.

So, for Chaos space marines, IG, I think we can fluff it as nids making an interesting tactic: Letting the symbiote weapons detach. Chaos warbands tend to scavenge, and I'm sure they've seen the weapons of Tyranids in action, so why wouldn't they try to get some to work? The result is a small link to the Hive Mind that grows and takes over minds.
IG/AM probably have a few simpletons who would pick up the weapons to look at them, thinking they're freaky (maybe even betting other squad members to touch it and such.)

[biomassbob]

space marine vets fighting tyranids over the years have come to realize that the Emperor has betrayed them and is the real enemy. The tyranids only want to return and reclaim the planets that were taken from them long ago. So space marine units, though still horrified by tyranid methods of consuming a population and unsure of their goals, have decided to reluctantly help the tyranids fight against a greater evil - everyone else. Oh, and tyranid synapse creatures can communicate in all the languages of cultures they have fought and absorbed - all the info you read is from the Imperium and their lies are to make the nids even more alien and needing to be destroyed. That is why tyranid characters are affected by challenges because they have pride and a kind of honour. Or just reasons!

[Threeshades]

May 26, 2014 16:19:53 GMT malebranche said:

- A Dark Eldar, Necron or mad scientists experiment where they have created their own form of synapse to control an isolated Tyranid force that was cut off from the hive mind.

This one is beautiful. Imagine the Tyranids branded with bar codes or a corporate logo and a number each on the side of their heads.

[Davor]

I love them all, this is all great. Keep them coming.

[heoga]

May 26, 2014 18:22:58 GMT Threeshades said:

May 26, 2014 16:19:53 GMT malebranche said:

- A Dark Eldar, Necron or mad scientists experiment where they have created their own form of synapse to control an isolated Tyranid force that was cut off from the hive mind.

This one is beautiful. Imagine the Tyranids branded with bar codes or a corporate logo and a number each on the side of their heads.

Aliens - Nightmare Asylum

[malebranche]

Another take on the "infestation" concept could be other forms of mind control. Even animals such as cats and dogs have adapted to play on human maternal instincts.

Imagine venomthropes pumping out powerful pheremones backed up by zoanthropes manipulating the minds of anything nearby to drive us to protect the very creatures that are devouring our world. I like the nightmarish imagery that brings to mind.

[rehkal]

I like the idea of the Tyranid adapting to use the technology of the enemy. Think of all the wonderful modelling opportunities for Nid Infested troops/vehicles.

[ziggythetrygon]

May 26, 2014 11:43:16 GMT Threeshades said:

2. Specialized Tyranid parasites have mind-slaved warriors of another race under their control, but the control these parasites exert is imperfect. They mostly work fine but sometimes have spasms and have to be handled with caution in case a parasite loses control over an extended period of time. This ones probably the best.

My Hive Fleet is actually based on the inverse of this. Yerk/Zerg-like creatures enslaving a genestealer brood and working from there. gradually learning to replace the Hive Mind's influence with their own, then evolving out the receptor organs entirely and inserting redesigned ones that only broadcast and receive their own.

[Davor]

May 27, 2014 4:43:24 GMT ziggythetrygon said:

May 26, 2014 11:43:16 GMT Threeshades said:

2. Specialized Tyranid parasites have mind-slaved warriors of another race under their control, but the control these parasites exert is imperfect. They mostly work fine but sometimes have spasms and have to be handled with caution in case a parasite loses control over an extended period of time. This ones probably the best.

My Hive Fleet is actually based on the inverse of this. Yerk/Zerg-like creatures enslaving a genestealer brood and working from there. gradually learning to replace the Hive Mind's influence with their own, then evolving out the receptor organs entirely and inserting redesigned ones that only broadcast and receive their own.

Hmmm.... could these be the critters that the Tyranids are running away from?

[zoda8]

I think this is an important thread with some great ideas. A puff of fluff makes all the difference!
In addition to fluff which is specific to particular armies, perhaps it is worth rethinking the general
logic behind 'nobody ever allies with nids'. As I understand it, the reason is 'because they eat you'.

It is believable that in warfare tactics change. Soldiers used to march into battle upright until the Boers
decided to lie on their tummies in cover. The Greek Phalanx ruled until it didn't. People even caught up
with Napoleon's tactics. Nobody ever allied with nids until the 'shadow of the shareholder' in Nottingham
made the 40k universe so unbalanced that armies were no longer self reliant and needed to ally as widely
as possible to survive.

So I am the Hive Mind, master of the cruddiest arsenal of firepower in the history of 40k warfare.
Am I not intelligent enough to realise that eating my allied devastator squads, flying croissants and drop
pods/chimeras full of melta would be a bad idea? Of course I am - I would sacrifice swathes of bugs to
protect that stuff, I'm not just gonna eat it. Allies with no other option would understand that. To keep
things fluffy though, I might keep allied troops 12 inches away from any nid unit which has feed as
instinctive behaviour, in case they fall out of synapse (throughout the game, not just at deployment!)

As an aside, some armies were never scared of Nids anyway - e.g. Dark Eldar that use them as entertainment, and can wipe out a whole army with poisoned shots in one turn of shooting. Ironically the repeated nerfing of nids may make them more palatable allies in the fluff, simply because they are less scary.

There is a question raised somewhere on this forum of 'who needs nids? - what do they offer as allies
that another army can't do better?' At the moment I think this is a valid question - in practical terms
I don't see lots of non tyranid players rushing out to buy FMC's etc. But the fact that other armies
might not want to take nid allies is not really our concern. Nor does it break the fluff - in the fluff
at least, another desperate army might not have a choice of any ally they fancy - it might be nids or
nothing. Whilst alliances with nids may meet with a luke warm reception from other players, for tyranids
it is their first chance ever to get good guns. That is massive. If you don't want to line GW's
pockets, go onto ebay with an open mind and find whichever army is selling off good guns for cheap. The
maelstrom of disillusionment will only add to the supply and keep prices down.

I am not anti GW because sadly, I don't see how they can survive as a business without constantly shifting
tons of plastic, and I want them to survive because I want a local shop to play in. That said, I really
do wish they would slow down just a tad. The paint on my Hive Crone is just about dry and they've already
nerfed his much trumpeted Vector Strike. So he's had about 1 outing for £44. It's cheaper at Chester Zoo!

[Davor]

After reading Zoda8 post I thought of another fluff example. It's behind the scenes allies. By that I mean, it's like how the Imperium or the Inquisitor (name on the tip of my tounge) used the Orks (unwilling allies?) to fight the Nids.

So maybe some factions somehow convinced their "friends" to ally with the NIds to battle the enemy. Low and behold the "friends" didn't know that the faction really wants the enemy defeated but at the same time want to eliminate the as well, knowing that the Nids will consume them later, or hoping they will be back stabbed. Something like the Inquisition getting a planet to ally up with the Nids to combat the Chaos threat and once the Chaos threat is eliminated the Nids will devourer the planet eliminating any Chaos taint on that planet and the Inquisition doesn't have to do anything to the planet afterwards.

[zoda8]

Thanks Davor,
Perhaps you could plant a couple of dead Tau commanders where they will be found by Nids and IG, with
fake plans for a massive invasion co-ordinated from the current outpost, aimed at mass extermination of
Nids and IG. A bit of incentive for everyone to pile in and wipe out the Tau outpost to hamper the coming
invasion. And the 'come the apocalypse' rules don't require you to view nids and IG as bezzy mates - it's
more like a three way 'friendly' down at the store where two hostile armies decide to gang up on the other
one cos its full of imperial knights and that is the biggest threat. Keeping allied troops apart and 'one
eye open', not sharing psychic powers or independent characters does reflect the ongoing mistrust between
desperate allies as well as is compatible with the game.